Calgary Flames MEGA THREAD 2017-2018 Edition

[dezmarez]

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TV deals/advertisement dwarf the revenue of seat sales

I always thought the NHL was a "gate revenue" league, and that almost half of the revenue was generated from ticket revenue.

[lasimmon]

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TV deals/advertisement dwarf the revenue of seat sales

Really? The flames have $121 million in revenue with $53 million in gate receipts.

[HiTempguy1]

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If you're talking about just hockey, sure. But arena revenues aren't just hockey. I mean, if we're selling out Hitmen and Roughnecks games at hockey prices, then we'd have a case for private investment in a Calgary arena.

Man, you are reeaaaalllllyyyy stretching things. We can build an arena to host those things without worrying about the flames. Look at Edmonton, all the big shows go to the outdoor fucking football stadium and nobody minds.

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Really? The flames have $121 million in revenue with $53 million in gate receipts.

I think a lot of people can't be objective about this subject. There is little reason to support public funding of this, and I don't think the flames being here does or doesn't change Calgary.

And if shows/concerts are such a big draw, then CLEARLY there is a private financially sound plan that can make an arena work.

[rage2]

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Man, you are reeaaaalllllyyyy stretching things. We can build an arena to host those things without worrying about the flames. Look at Edmonton, all the big shows go to the outdoor fucking football stadium and nobody minds.

OK, let me ask you a simple question. What metro area with <2m population have a 100% financed arena where the owners didn't lose their shirts?

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There is little reason to support public funding of this, and I don't think the flames being here does or doesn't change Calgary.

There is little to no financial benefits for having a pro hockey team in Calgary. Life goes on. Sure there are some effects at the micro level, but the big picture, nothing changes. The benefits of a pro hockey team are purely social. The question is, is that worth $200-300m that the Flames are asking for? If you're looking at it from a purely financial perspective, it's clear that it makes zero sense for Calgary.

If you look back at my history on CalgaryNEXT, I was 100% against direct public funding. I was looking at it purely from a financial perspective. Now? I'm on the fence. I don't know if my enjoyment of hockey and following the Flames this long is worth $200-300m of our collective tax dollars. On one hand, I can justify it because my tax dollars have gone up paying for things I never use, so why not spend some it on something where I have a huge benefit? On the other hand, I'd be a hypocrite for bashing the library and all our stupid spending and not bash this, as it's a huge chunk of change that benefits a minor percentage of the population.

[89coupe]

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[Manhattan]

$200-300m for an arena that lasts 20 to 30 years is not a huge number for a municipal budget. Will there be terms in place that keeps the team here if its built? Worst case scenario is the arena is funded by the team is sold and moves anyway.

[rage2]

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Calgary does not finance the new library, that is federal funding.

Either he’s fucking with you or he’s a fucking idiot.

Edit - $40m from city, $135m from CIF, $70m from CRL.

City is from our municipal tax dollars, CIF is a overpayment refund from our municipal tax dollars, CRL is a municipal tax dollar diversion scheme, basically the area’s tax dollars doesn’t go towards city revenue, but to itself for revitalizing the area, which means our municipal tax dollars are subsidizing theirs since they don’t contribute. Basically, 100% from municipal tax dollars.

[rage2]

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$200-300m for an arena that lasts 20 to 30 years is not a huge number for a municipal budget. Will there be terms in place that keeps the team here if its built? Worst case scenario is the arena is funded by the team is sold and moves anyway.

Well the city proposal had the flames pretty much paying for it all and locked to the city for 35 years, with the city retaining rights to use the arena during stampede lol.

Regardless, any deal where the city pays, you can guarantee the team is locked down to the city with a potential buy out clause.

[Thaco]

King needs to hire a PR person, he just babbled and said nothing at all...

all i heard was "money money, business, revenue... oh, its not about money.... money money money."

[asp integra]

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King needs to hire a PR person, he just babbled and said nothing at all...

all i heard was "money money, business, revenue... oh, its not about money.... money money money."

All people in positions like that will dance around and never really answer the question. You ever heard a straight answer from a politician? Doesn't happen

[89coupe]

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[rage2]

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I relayed your comments to him, waiting to hear what he has to say.

Gotcha?

The funding model has been public forever. Probably even posted on signs at the construction site.

[colinxx235]

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Really? The flames have $121 million in revenue with $53 million in gate receipts.

My context is more in relation to American sports (HiTemp was arguing Seattle vs Calgary stadium).
Canadian television deals are nowhere near the states. Easiest example of this would be the Dodgers.

Even with the small TV market in comparison the gate receipts numbers you provided are still under 50%. I'm not sure what the deals would be in the Washington area but more than likely greater than what Rogers pays the Canadian teams.

[dino_martini]

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King needs to hire a PR person, he just babbled and said nothing at all...

all i heard was "money money, business, revenue... oh, its not about money.... money money money."

They should have had Conroy head up the new arena proposal. No one likes Ken King. I hope he gets shit canned over all this ridiculous bull shit the Flames are spewing. I'm voting Chabot for mayor ����.♂️

I'm excited for the actual season to begin, and go check out T-Mobile Arena when the Flames play in Vegas in February.

[Buster]

Riddell and Edwards managed to become billionaires, and yet are getting worked in negotiations with a bunch if muni employees (who are not generally considered rocket scientists).

Maybe it's easier than you think to become a billionaire when commodity prices go on a 15 year run.

[Thaco]

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All people in positions like that will dance around and never really answer the question. You ever heard a straight answer from a politician? Doesn't happen

did you see Nenshi's address? i thought it was pretty clear, concise and easy to understand.

[suntan]

Ug. What's funny about this is that KK is willing to front me a few million dollars for a tech startup I'm thinking of. But I don't want to have anything to do with him because I know how he's like when things don't go his way. Sure was on display today.

[rage2]

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They should have had Conroy head up the new arena proposal. No one likes Ken King. I hope he gets shit canned over all this ridiculous bull shit the Flames are spewing. I'm voting Chabot for mayor ����.♂️

I'm excited for the actual season to begin, and go check out T-Mobile Arena when the Flames play in Vegas in February.

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Ug. What's funny about this is that KK is willing to front me a few million dollars for a tech startup I'm thinking of. But I don't want to have anything to do with him because I know how he's like when things don't go his way. Sure was on display today.

Just out of curiosity, do you find the City's proposal released today a good deal for the Flames?

[suntan]

Any time you get free money is a good deal.

Clearly the city is willing to give the team money for nothing. It seems the cost of the arena is now set in stone so now it's just a matter of how much will be subsidized by taxpayers.

Nenshi is such a terrible, terrible negotiator.

[Buster]

Why do we have to give them any money at all.

The team is not moving. Never was. Never will be.

1. It will delay the owners getting an expansion fee for longer
2. Rogers just paid billions for the rights to broadcast to 7 NHL markets. They aren't going to want the NHL to strip a team from one of those markets.

How does the city not know that it has leverage here?