Calgary Flames MEGA THREAD 2017-2018 Edition

[dj_patm]

So here is the cities offer. I can't believe the Flames walked away from the table after this:

[89coupe]

We pay taxes for the city to maintain our city and keep the city vibrant. Having a new Arena would provide the city access to venues that couldn't book here in the past, creating jobs, creating tourism, creating a city that thrives. Toronto is a perfect example of a city that thrives, it has multiple arenas that can host events. Restaurants, Bars, Cafes, they all survive because these Arenas bring people and business. I think Calgary is foolish not to see the benefits. Calgary needs to look at the future and diversify before it's too late. Tourism and hospitality are key to growth in a big city. Downtown Calgary is a ghost town after 6:00pm

[Thaco]

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We pay taxes for the city to maintain our city and keep the city vibrant. Having a new Arena would provide the city access to venues that couldn't book here in the past, creating jobs, creating tourism, creating a city that thrives. Toronto is a perfect example of a city that thrives, it has multiple arenas that can host events. Restaurants, Bars, Cafes, they all survive because these Arenas bring people and business. I think Calgary is foolish not to see the benefits. Calgary needs to look at the future and diversify before it's too late. Tourism and hospitality are key to growth in a big city. Downtown Calgary is a ghost town after 6:00pm

ironic that in seattle the private business incurred 100% of the costs of the stadium upgrade and still gave the city $40 mil for infrastructure projects related to the facility.....

[asp integra]

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So here is the cities offer. I can't believe the Flames walked away from the table after this:

Did they say where the location would be for this proposal?

[Thaco]

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Did they say where the location would be for this proposal?

vic park.. it doesnt make sense on the west end, its already fully developed, there's no room to build around the facility, so there's not a lot of potential for other business and revenue for facilities around the arena..
there a ton of recently vacated room in vic park/east village, not to mention the dome will be demolished to make more room.

[adam c]

Maybe the ownership doesn't like the 35 year commitment

[lasimmon]

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We pay taxes for the city to maintain our city and keep the city vibrant. Having a new Arena would provide the city access to venues that couldn't book here in the past, creating jobs, creating tourism, creating a city that thrives. Toronto is a perfect example of a city that thrives, it has multiple arenas that can host events. Restaurants, Bars, Cafes, they all survive because these Arenas bring people and business. I think Calgary is foolish not to see the benefits. Calgary needs to look at the future and diversify before it's too late. Tourism and hospitality are key to growth in a big city. Downtown Calgary is a ghost town after 6:00pm

Its funny you mention Toronto.. Which has a privately funded Arena.

[rage2]

Greater Seattle Area: 3.6m population
Greater Toronto Area: 6.4m population
Greater Calgary Area: 1.2m population

That’s why there’s no 100% private investment to build an arena here. It’s now a comparable market to those that have thrived. Every small market city that has tried, the owners lost it all. Seattle is actually pretty borderline in terms of size, but they have by far the largest disposable income that compensates.

[89coupe]

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Its funny you mention Toronto.. Which has a privately funded Arena.

Unfortunate but if the people of Calgary don't support it I have a feeling this city will eventually wither away.

[Wakalimasu]

How are the flames losing money if they sell out every game? I don't understand that :O

[rage2]

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So here is the cities offer. I can't believe the Flames walked away from the table after this:

It’s a worst deal than what they have today with the Saddledome. They’re currently paying no property tax or rent. The addition of a property tax is basically clawback for the city’s direct contribution. And they’re locked in for 35 years. The city could easily fuck with taxation down the road or clawback more by other means. Huge risks for the Flames.

At least the city separated out direct and indirect contributions this time around. CalgaryNEXT proposal, the city put all indirect costs, including cost of borrowing as a direct cost.

What the Flames ultimately want is the same expenditure they’re on the hook for today, and a 1/3 cash contribution, 1/3 ticket tax (which they consider their own contribution) and the city to contribute the rest. City would own the building, they would not pay rent in lieu of managing the building and maintenance like today. They prob also want land and demolition costs off the books because that’s skewing the share by the city since it’s the city’s arenas.

[rage2]

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How are the flames losing money if they sell out every game? I don't understand that :O

Sell out streak ended when oil crashed. Flames aren’t losing money today, but it’s trending downwards with an old building, loss of events, etc. the USD isn’t helping. Spending cap max on players isn’t helping. Unless you win with a bunch of lottery balls, you need to spend to the cap to be competitive.

I still have a gut feeling that the Flames know that the Calgary market will take a while to recover, and that this is all a smoke and mirrors show to sell the team.

[lasimmon]

Yah you could go to games with probably a thousand or more empty seats last year.

[Quizzes]

I could see why the Flames didn't like this deal. Sneaky of the City to sneak in the Saddledome demolition cost as their contribution.

[rage2]

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I could see why the Flames didn't like this deal. Sneaky of the City to sneak in the Saddledome demolition cost as their contribution.

You gotta give them credit, at least it’s better than their CalgaryNEXT analysis that threw in almost a billion dollars worth of indirect spending as taxpayer contribution haha.

[dirtsniffer]

Does the city even have the financial capability of building an arena? from my understanding we are looking at a huge tax increase just to cover what we are spending already. City council put the increase off until after the election in hopes they get voted back in. but the finances are fucked. throwing an arena into the mix is not going to help.

[HiTempguy1]

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Greater Seattle Area: 3.6m population
Greater Toronto Area: 6.4m population
Greater Calgary Area: 1.2m population

.

You make it sound like each metro area is exactly identical in makeup and demographic. They aren't. I would argue that Calgary has a higher per capita turnout

Its like Sask and the roughriders. Its all they got, so they all are on the bandwagon

[ExtraSlow]

Well, One things for sure, the current council doesn't have any ability to do this deal before the election, even if the flames were agreeable to the citys proposal. So taking a break from negotiations makes a lot of sense.
Who knows what the next council will prioritize?

[rage2]

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You make it sound like each metro area is exactly identical in makeup and demographic. They aren't. I would argue that Calgary has a higher per capita turnout

If you're talking about just hockey, sure. But arena revenues aren't just hockey. I mean, if we're selling out Hitmen and Roughnecks games at hockey prices, then we'd have a case for private investment in a Calgary arena.

[colinxx235]

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You make it sound like each metro area is exactly identical in makeup and demographic. They aren't. I would argue that Calgary has a higher per capita turnout

Its like Sask and the roughriders. Its all they got, so they all are on the bandwagon

TV deals/advertisement dwarf the revenue of seat sales