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    Student...I would be a student for the rest of my life...

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    PAID student.

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    Quote Originally Posted by revelations View Post
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    The guys and gals on the front lines get a pass from me, regarding their "government" job. You should be directing your anger towards those sitting in an office somewhere in nowhere Canada, collecting 60k a year for 30 years, for a simple/menial job that could easily be outsourced to a local contractor, and would result in improved efficiency and employment of people who want to work.
    I'd agree with this.

    Couldn't pay me enough to be a first responder. The toll it would take on my personal life would be significant, and I've talked to a few people who have worked in CFD and PD and they concur.

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    Both these things can be true:

    -first responders deal with the nasty parts of life:

    - First responders work "166 days a year", get a lot of time for random vacations, get pay sufficient to get them on the sunshine list, retire after relatively short careers, and according to Ben, rather than "awful" being the main thing to consider, things are "mostly good times".

    He was advocating for the career because of all of the upside.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cjblair View Post
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    Only thing I might change at this point is getting an executive MBA, but it's taking some time to psych myself up for the jump from 50hr work weeks to 80hr+ work weeks haha.
    The struggle is real, it is not an insignificant challenge and I definitely underestimated it. I would kill for the EMBA schedule compared to mine, the stress of trying to get to class after work is brutal when you are actually busy at the office...

    Law school would definitely be interesting, but based on my skills at arguing with people on the internet I think I would be shitty at it. Personally I don't think my engineering degree is worth the paper it's written on and the only thing that makes me valuable anymore is my on the job experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Definitely not funny.

    My point is/was that tax-payers tend to not like to hear tax-recipients brag about the lifestyles provided to them when it involves "sunshines lists", working only "166 days a year" regularly being able to "take flights wherever". As for the horrors and stress...I'm sure, but as you say...."most days its good times."

    Take what the system is willing to provide to you in the form of pay and benefits. But when I'm staring at my tax bill (and my accountants bill trying to shave a point here or there off my rate), don't think I'm not reminded of threads like this. When my ex-military friends brag about their retirement benefits, or my cop cousins brag about getting out of the force at forty-whatever to a generous pension, or my firefighter friends are starting side-businesses with their extra time - they all universally seem to forget that someone is actually paying the bill for the extravagances, and they are usually right there.
    Exactly. If I'm paying anyone, I want them to be miserable all the time and regret every decision they made to get to that point. I can't stand the thought of anyone enjoying themselves with my money. If they're not praying for death I'm paying them too much.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Both these things can be true:

    -first responders deal with the nasty parts of life:

    - First responders work "166 days a year", get a lot of time for random vacations, get pay sufficient to get them on the sunshine list, retire after relatively short careers, and according to Ben, rather than "awful" being the main thing to consider, things are "mostly good times".

    He was advocating for the career because of all of the upside.
    Well you gotta look on the bright side so when some meth head tries to stab you in the face and then shits on the gurney you have something to look forward to.

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    Last I heard Fire and the cops weren't desperate for recruits? Am I mistaken on this?

    Is supply and demand functioning in the world of first responders if getting into fire is virtually impossible? What's the normal course of action if there is a year long line-up of people waiting to work for you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Both these things can be true:
    - First responders work "166 days a year", get a lot of time for random vacations, get pay sufficient to get them on the sunshine list, retire after relatively short careers, and according to Ben, rather than "awful" being the main thing to consider, things are "mostly good times".
    He was advocating for the career because of all of the upside.
    Very true, but consider that 166 days... that is days worked, not hours. Ben also mentioned there are 12-14 hr shifts.

    -I had to look up what the Sunshine list is... so ~$100k+. In a quick look of some other published BC Sunshine list info, it appears to be mostly higher ranking Police/RCMP, certainly not your everyday joe. Assuming someone works their way up the ranks to Sergeant+ I think thats a fair wage. If I read correctly RCMP tops out around $150k.

    -Id gladly pay my taxes for someone to get paid that much to deal with that stuff.. if it was that easy everyone would do it. Certainly not all speeding tickets and walking in parades without their uniforms on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by R-Audi View Post
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    Very true, but consider that 166 days... that is days worked, not hours. Ben also mentioned there are 12-14 hr shifts.

    -I had to look up what the Sunshine list is... so ~$100k+. In a quick look of some other published BC Sunshine list info, it appears to be mostly higher ranking Police/RCMP, certainly not your everyday joe. Assuming someone works their way up the ranks to Sergeant+ I think thats a fair wage. If I read correctly RCMP tops out around $150k.

    -Id gladly pay my taxes for someone to get paid that much to deal with that stuff.. if it was that easy everyone would do it. Certainly not all speeding tickets and walking in parades without their uniforms on.
    Not to mention the difference in the definition of "awful"... my definition in my current office job would be when you get caught in between business execs and the IT delivery teams because shits not being delivered on time. A cop's definition would be something more akin to "I got shot at and/or bitten by some crazy lady on meth". Not apples to apples. I have zero qualms about their pay and "benefits" when you factor in all the other shit they have to deal with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil4Speed View Post
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    Fire Pays surprisingly good, plus a Pension at the end of it.

    http://www.calgary.ca/CSPS/Fire/Page...-benefits.aspx
    I would have to assume that you have to start young or you have been an athlete for most of your career.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Last I heard Fire and the cops weren't desperate for recruits? Am I mistaken on this?
    Cops are, but I would argue they have higher standards when it comes to personality and education.

    Fire is a bit different. Seems like a lot of adrenaline types do it. I know guys who volunteered for years in fire departments. Same guys also are the ones who spend a lot of time at the gym/working out, which you basically get paid to do if in fire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Both these things can be true:

    -first responders deal with the nasty parts of life:

    - First responders work "166 days a year", get a lot of time for random vacations, get pay sufficient to get them on the sunshine list, retire after relatively short careers, and according to Ben, rather than "awful" being the main thing to consider, things are "mostly good times".

    He was advocating for the career because of all of the upside.
    Who would advocate a career for the downside? Some Cops probably skate through their career and do the bare minimum just to get to their pension, some for sure don't and have to deal with some real fucked up shit. There is so much stupid shit tax dollars get wasted on why are you so hung up on this one haha

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    Quote Originally Posted by revelations View Post
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    The guys and gals on the front lines get a pass from me, regarding their "government" job. You should be directing your anger towards those sitting in an office somewhere in nowhere Canada, collecting 60k a year for 30 years, for a simple/menial job that could easily be outsourced to a local contractor, and would result in improved efficiency and employment of people who want to work.
    There are many of those 30 year 60k people who are worth their money and put in a good days work but there are many that just float along as well - been there, done that, wasn't a floater by any means but worked with many that were.

    As far as the 166 days, at 13 hours a day that more hours worked in a year than a regular 9-5er.
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    Buster, I don't know you other than you've been a registered user on this site almost as long as I have. I know you drive some rediculous Benz and a number of other high end rides and you share your life of opulence conservatively on here but still leave treats and cookies for folks to wonder more about this Buster guy. You have accountants and nannies and you never say what you do for work which is your choice as it is equally mine to explain vaguely what I do. But who the hell do you think you are criticizing what I make and what benefits I have when you know obviously nothing about me or what I actually see and do in my so called tax payer gravy train. Is 100k a year really all that much money these days? Really? I laughed that my deliberate choice of the word sunshine list actually got a rise out of someone. You want someone to be mad at be me at our politicians that made these decisions be mad at the folks that sit for a few years elected making million dollar pensions and all the like. I pay a thousand bucks a cheque into my god damn pension just to get half o it back after 25 years and for what sacrifice. Most of us die a couple years into retirement so don't worry your taxes won't even have paid for those pensions yet. Of course I would talk about the positives why wouldn't I? The stories I have about the negatives are not repeatable in polite company. And don't give me the whole Im a tax payer I pay your salary. Buster the way you called down what I chose to go to work to do (that I left to do well into my working years) and likened me to somethin to save a point on on your precious taxes is both insulting to anyone who has ever served this country and embarrassing for you to be so niave and arrogant. I bet you wouldn't even get out of bed in the morning for what I get paid. I made a concious decision to change careers because of a number of reasons an it has been great for me. Conveniently you observed the plus points in my posts however ignored and demonstrated ignorance towards the negatives in a quite insulting manner. Do your military friends and police cousins you spoke of know how you really feel? I know more than a few that would leave you leaking in a second for trivializing how they "earned" their pensions (which for most are pathetic compared to what you had to pay into) on various tours and the toll it's taken. I shake my head at you sir for lack of appreciation and understanding. But don't worry Us types are only a quick phone call away if you ever need a hand or if you lose one too. We'll still be there 24/7/365 ready to run into where others woul run out of regardless of your opinion of us because that's what we took an oath to do stay safe out there and enjoy your weekend. I know I will.


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    Where's the like button already.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben View Post
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    I left IT when I packed up and moved away from Calgary in 2007. Lived the life of do whatever I wanted in New Zealand, soul searched and and blew my life savings on seeing the world. When I finally came back home in 2009 I went into law enforcement, got through the whole year+ application process and been doing it 7 years now. Sure it doesn't pay "rigger pay" where everyone brags about their massive pay and yet don't have 20 bucks to put diesel in their $100,00 truck when the economy slumps but I still make it on the sunshine list after putting in my time and getting my raises etc, and I know every day I wake up I have a job. That and with the schedule I'm on I only work 166 calendar days a year before annual leave and family related leave and sick days. I have 200+ days off a year to do whatever I want. heck I can work another job doing something else I like if I want, but mostly we just catch a flight somewhere for a few days and get away. Sure there are some days that are awful, just awful, but most days its good times. It's not for everyone and you have to have a good home life to help you through some rough ones but I would definitely say it was the best decision I ever made as I personally just hated Monday to Friday office life, having a phone always attached to me putting in long days while salaried and fixing stupid shit just to have to repeat it again the next day. You'll never be absolutely rich doing it but you'll always be able to live comfortably.

    I would agree that the pay versus education required is a good ratio especially for where I came from, but that's not to say you can be a dropout either. And we're not a bunch of hothead bullies that got picked on in school either with a superiority complex , lots with amazing life stories and experience before joining the thin blue line. And a lot with many letters after their names too that decided to follow their passion instead of their educations.

    And don't get me started on the kinds of toys you get to play with
    Leave it to a government employee to be proud of working 165 days a year and bragging on a public forum about it. What a fking joke our government is, this is why we are going into bankruptcy as a province. No police officers other then real detectives (solving murders/real crimes), GU and the special task force deserve 6 figures for working even a full year and this clown is bragging about working half a year because he takes sick leave and family leave.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Type_S1 View Post
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    Leave it to a government employee to be proud of working 165 days a year and bragging on a public forum about it. What a fking joke our government is, this is why we are going into bankruptcy as a province. No police officers other then real detectives (solving murders/real crimes), GU and the special task force deserve 6 figures for working even a full year and this clown is bragging about working half a year because he takes sick leave and family leave.
    May I ask what you do and what your hours of work are? I ask because I put in more than full time hours over the course of a year just in less days from working 12 or 16 hour days. Some fire departments work 24 hour shifts and then get a week off. Those bums. I'm sorry you feel that way. Heaven forbid you have any days off in between cutting dead kids out of cars or console a rape victim left for dead. Definitely not bragging and you're always free to apply if you'd do it for less. . Work on your reading comprehension as it is a prerequisite.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben View Post
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    Buster, I don't know you other than you've been a registered user on this site almost as long as I have. I know you drive some rediculous Benz and a number of other high end rides and you share your life of opulence conservatively on here but still leave treats and cookies for folks to wonder more about this Buster guy. You have accountants and nannies and you never say what you do for work which is your choice as it is equally mine to explain vaguely what I do. But who the hell do you think you are criticizing what I make and what benefits I have when you know obviously nothing about me or what I actually see and do in my so called tax payer gravy train. Is 100k a year really all that much money these days? Really? I laughed that my deliberate choice of the word sunshine list actually got a rise out of someone. You want someone to be mad at be me at our politicians that made these decisions be mad at the folks that sit for a few years elected making million dollar pensions and all the like. I pay a thousand bucks a cheque into my god damn pension just to get half o it back after 25 years and for what sacrifice. Most of us die a couple years into retirement so don't worry your taxes won't even have paid for those pensions yet. Of course I would talk about the positives why wouldn't I? The stories I have about the negatives are not repeatable in polite company. And don't give me the whole Im a tax payer I pay your salary. Buster the way you called down what I chose to go to work to do (that I left to do well into my working years) and likened me to somethin to save a point on on your precious taxes is both insulting to anyone who has ever served this country and embarrassing for you to be so niave and arrogant. I bet you wouldn't even get out of bed in the morning for what I get paid. I made a concious decision to change careers because of a number of reasons an it has been great for me. Conveniently you observed the plus points in my posts however ignored and demonstrated ignorance towards the negatives in a quite insulting manner. Do your military friends and police cousins you spoke of know how you really feel? I know more than a few that would leave you leaking in a second for trivializing how they "earned" their pensions (which for most are pathetic compared to what you had to pay into) on various tours and the toll it's taken. I shake my head at you sir for lack of appreciation and understanding. But don't worry Us types are only a quick phone call away if you ever need a hand or if you lose one too. We'll still be there 24/7/365 ready to run into where others woul run out of regardless of your opinion of us because that's what we took an oath to do stay safe out there and enjoy your weekend. I know I will.
    This is a fair post. Looking back on what I said, I came out swinging at you personally and you didn't deserve that, and the frontline workers shouldn't really bear the burden of the criticisms someone has about government waste, simply because they are a visible target. Sorry about that - I think you deserve an apology. (I also know you were generously trying to help the OP, and I derailed that with my ideological ramblings.) I sometimes let my passion over the money side of things overshadow the fact that the services that the frontline workers provide are actual necessities for a society to function and I will be the first to acknowledge this.

    A couple of things I will add, which I think are worth considering:

    - gov't employee compensation should be like any other employee compensation: it should be a fair topic of discussion in a productive way. I don't think it is healthy for it to be a no-go zone.
    - Much of my issue isn't with the workers or their compensation. I actually have no idea how much a cop or a firefighter should get paid. I really don't, and I don't really have an opinion on it. What I would look like to see is a dismantling of the public union system, so that we can allow the market to determine how much a cop/firefighter/teacher etc gets paid both in cash, entitlements, pension, etc. I don't think that's an unfair approach or request as it is how the whole rest of the world does things, and it works okay.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    This is a fair post. Looking back on what I said, I came out swinging at you personally and you didn't deserve that, and the frontline workers shouldn't really bear the burden of the criticisms someone has about government waste, simply because they are a visible target. Sorry about that - I think you deserve an apology. (I also know you were generously trying to help the OP, and I derailed that with my ideological ramblings.) I sometimes let my passion over the money side of things overshadow the fact that the services that the frontline workers provide are actual necessities for a society to function and I will be the first to acknowledge this.

    A couple of things I will add, which I think are worth considering:

    - gov't employee compensation should be like any other employee compensation: it should be a fair topic of discussion in a productive way. I don't think it is healthy for it to be a no-go zone.
    - Much of my issue isn't with the workers or their compensation. I actually have no idea how much a cop or a firefighter should get paid. I really don't, and I don't really have an opinion on it. What I would look like to see is a dismantling of the public union system, so that we can allow the market to determine how much a cop/firefighter/teacher etc gets paid both in cash, entitlements, pension, etc. I don't think that's an unfair approach or request as it is how the whole rest of the world does things, and it works okay.
    Excellent post I 100% agree with it and it goes both ways sorry for shitting back.

    I see excessive wasteful spending on stupid shit and those things do get auctioned but I do hate when the public shits on the front line staff because they're the easy target. Most folks have no actual idea and that's probably a good thing lol


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