Stand back Blue Ring, there is a new piece of public art in town!

[Mitsu3000gt]

I'm fine with art (in fact I enjoy it in most other cities because it's actually recognizable as such) but not hilariously overpriced literal garbage. It's not like Beyond is some small group of people who hates the ring and the new rusty garbage pile among the other junk projects - NOBODY likes it, and most people don't even know it's art, because it's so bad. I don't know one single person who either likes them, or even knows that they are supposed to be art. I'm also generally bothered by the fact that people can make whatever crap they want and just call it art - I have this theory that artists get together in secret meetings and laugh about what they were able to convince people is "art".

[suntan]

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As far as the bidding on locations is concerned, given the current public art climate I'd be doubtful that any large company would be willing to sponsor any artist/artwork in fear of public outcry and a damaged reputation. For the most part public artwork in the city has only drawn negative attention, save for the cows, but those are quite ancient now. With no funding from companies to produce the work, unfortunately very few artists in the city would be able to create the work, let alone pay a bid for the space.

Wut. Companies were a huge source of funds for artists in town. The drop in oil prices did a number though.

[Sugarphreak]

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[Chantastic]

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Wut. Companies were a huge source of funds for artists in town. The drop in oil prices did a number though.

I could be wrong on this and please let me know if I am because I am curious, but typically those amounts awarded to artists as prizes from companies like Enmax are only in small sums and are not intended for public artwork directly. They are also no where near the budgets we are currently discussing. Large companies will certainly pay for artwork for their buildings offices (take the Bow building when it first opened for example (save for the giant head, as that was a public artwork)), and will also fund the local major theater companies in town, but as far as I am aware never any of the large public artworks. From the cities website:

City of Calgary capital projects over $1 million allocate 1% of the first $50 million of eligible project costs and 0.5% of the portion over $50 million to public art, up to a maximum of $4 million per project.

[suntan]

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I could be wrong on this and please let me know if I am because I am curious, but typically those amounts awarded to artists as prizes from companies like Enmax are only in small sums and are not intended for public artwork directly. They are also no where near the budgets we are currently discussing. Large companies will certainly pay for artwork for their buildings offices (take the Bow building when it first opened for example (save for the giant head, as that was a public artwork)), and will also fund the local major theater companies in town, but as far as I am aware never any of the large public artworks. From the cities website:

City of Calgary capital projects over $1 million allocate 1% of the first $50 million of eligible project costs and 0.5% of the portion over $50 million to public art, up to a maximum of $4 million per project.

Who the fuck is talking about public artwork. I'm talking about artists getting paid in general. And Encana commissioned the head, for fuck's sake. It's not public art, dummy.

[Chantastic]

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Who the fuck is talking about public artwork. I'm talking about artists getting paid in general. And Encana commissioned the head, for fuck's sake. It's not public art, dummy.

Yikes, did I not start that post out by saying I could be wrong? Here I was thinking I was having a conversation with an mature individual.

[Chantastic]

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I am actually a bit intrigued on why you think this

Public Art is nice... but necessary? In what way?



I was considering this point this morning a bit, and I think that my proposed system of bidding on display location leases has two separate scenarios that would satisfy this issue

First, if a company decides to bid on a location, they could either pay the artist for their time, or commission/purchase the art

In the second scenario, the company just sponsors the artist to get a location and yeah... he needs to work for free. However technically the art in that scenario would still belong to them, and if is not deemed valuable by society, it could be sold or leased out based on how good it actually is. If indeed it is deemed worthless... well, then it is kind of a good thing nobody paid for a pile of crap.


It isn't just companies that could sponsor either. If you had areas in communities which were to be auctioned off, groups within the community could come together and help commission an artist to produce something they feel beautifies their community, which is what this is really all about. You know, instead of the city going "Here is 500K, do something cool" and an artist going "Ok, here is your pile of manged shopping carts... what? it's art... it represents consumerism and shit, plus it was free... er... recycled materials... fuck you, you're not my Dad... I'm going to go burn myself to see if I can still feel".

While I do think the second scenario has merit, I unfortunately still think it's unlikely that many artists would be able to afford the construction costs of any large budget project, even with the help of a community. Not to say that the budget has to be large either. There's plenty of smaller scale public artworks in the city that were quite effective with minimal public backlash. But if the fact that non locals are getting these large commissions is a large part of why people are upset, then the scenario doesn't resolve the issue. As far as pay is concerned, creating the works prior to funding approval/jury selection is a dangerous game when you're talking large dollar amounts. While this would be no different than say putting together a cover letter and resume for a company and for them to not pick you for a job, I do feel that only large companies (large compared to a single artist/community) would be able to financially support themselves if the pitch wasn't accepted, and as a result we again run into the problem of no locals. I'll think on this some more.

On a side note, in regards to the Blue Ring, apparently 55 applications were made and only 3 were Calgarian.

[Sugarphreak]

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[Swank]

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- a traffic light can cost between $250-500k to create

Mother of fack, I gotta learn how to build and install those. Retirement 45 here I come!

[Chantastic]

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I honestly think that a lot of companies would step up and pay for things like materials and construction costs, and even compensation for the artist to some degree

For some of the large scale projects, and I am specifically talking about ones that are intended to be true iconic and symbols of the city, I am ok with the city paying for a few of those provided it actually delivers. To ensure that happens, there needs to be a lot more input from the public when it comes to locations, and ensuring that it will get received positively. What needs to be happening is having accurate renders of what the final product will look like (not conceptual drafts) placed on the city website, and average people should be able to vote on them prior to contracts being awarded. Project renders that receive less than a 75% positive review should be scrapped, and if none remain after that process, then new ones should be considered.

Locations like where the Blue Ring and this latest project were placed are frankly idiotic... not to mention they are not even close to what I would consider to be iconic for the city, they are not somewhere that people can truly enjoy them, and they certainly don't have the calibur of art that I would expect given the price tag. It makes even less sense to tie the budget in with infrastructure spending. They should be stand alone, and thoughtfully placed to help bolster the cities culture and image.

Location is so key for these works. I'm not saying it would have been 100% well received, but imagine if the blue ring (Travelling Light is the real name, if anyone cares) was placed downtown where people actually walk by it rather than fly by in a car and not actually notice it. It also has lights at the top of the sculpture that could be completely functional in the right area. By placing it where it is accessible via foot, that opens the possibility up to engagement. That probably would have been a success as it would act as a frame to whatever you were photographing through it.

[killramos]

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Mother of fack, I gotta learn how to build and install those. Retirement 45 here I come!

The only word more expensive than Enterprise; Government.

[Chantastic]

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Mother of fack, I gotta learn how to build and install those. Retirement 45 here I come!

Let me in on the details!

[Abeo]

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As far as the bidding on locations is concerned, given the current public art climate I'd be doubtful that any large company would be willing to sponsor any artist/artwork in fear of public outcry and a damaged reputation. For the most part public artwork in the city has only drawn negative attention, save for the cows, but those are quite ancient now.

Of course they would fear public outcry. If a large company is embarrassed to sponsor the type of art that's being made, doesn't that say something in part about the art itself? How about making public art that the majority of the population can understand (and even appreciate), especially when they become statement pieces on the entrance to town?
If I buy or create art for my house, it's something that I will want to look at every day. If I am tasked to buy art for my company's lobby, it's going to be something that I hope will be pleasing for our clients to look at. This intention of audience is totally lost in the current public art process, and just appears to be artist self-congratulation and artistic masturbation in the public arena, with the public picking up the cheque.

[01RedDX]

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[Tik-Tok]

Doesn't matter. He's still stealing culture,that bastard!

[lilmira]

So this is like people getting tattoos in language that they don''t understand.

[msommers]

Nenshi's statement:

Hi folks! I'd like to share with all of you a joint statement from the Chiefs of the Treaty 7 Nations and myself regarding the Bowfort Towers and The City of Calgary's public art policy. I'm grateful that we've been able to work together to confirm our commitment to moving forward on this and other issues.

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There has been a lot of discussion and a number of misunderstandings around the Bowfort Towers art project in Calgary. We, the undersigned, would like to acknowledge what has happened, clarify some facts, and suggest some steps for the future.

The City of Calgary is located on traditional indigenous lands located in the region covered by Treaty 7 signed in 1877 between Canada, the Pikani Nation, Kainai Nation, Sikiska Nation (together the Blackfoot Confederacy), the Bearspaw Nation, Chiniki Nation and Wesley Nation (together the Stoney Nakoda Nations) and the Tsuu T'ina Nation. Today, the Treaty 7 Nations continue to come together on a regular basis to work towards the needs of their people, the protection of traditional lands and indigenous rights. As we continue to work towards reconciliation, the Blackfoot Confederacy, Stoney Nakoda Nations, Tsuu T’ina Nations and The City of Calgary will continue to work together to ensure the ongoing recognition within Calgary of the traditional territory of these great Nations.

We’d like to start by acknowledging that, in this time of reconciliation, The City of Calgary has taken steps to improve its relationship with its indigenous neighbours. The City of Calgary has demonstrated an interest in moving forward in reconciliation and common prosperity through actions such as permanently raising the Treaty 7 flag at City Hall to adopting an official Indigenous Policy. In addition, in 2015, The City was honoured that a traditional medicine wheel was constructed in Nose Hill Park by members of the Blackfoot Confederacy to honour the cultural and historical significance of the area. This landmark serves as tribute and an educational tool.

The arts can help to strengthen the relationship between indigenous and non-indigenous people. We point to Making Treaty 7—a theatrical presentation that tells the story of the events that took place at Blackfoot Crossing in 1877—as an example of how the arts can create a deeper understanding of our collective history and help to pave a path forward.

With regards to the Bowfort Towers project:

• The City of Calgary commissioned this installation in 2015 as part of a larger interchange project, under its public art policy. The total cost of the art was about $500,000 or 0.7% of the total cost of the interchange project.

• As is its usual practice, the City convened a committee made up of three volunteers from the arts community, three citizens-at-large from the nearby Calgary neighbourhoods, and one member of City administration.

• The City opened the competition to bidders from around the world, as it is required to do pursuant to trade agreements on all projects over $75,000.

• This was never meant to be an indigenous art work, nor inspired by indigenous themes. This was not part of the request for proposals that was sent out by The City.

• However, given the significance of the land, and following the guidelines of The City’s new Indigenous Policy, The City asked the artist (late in the design process) to seek the expertise of a Treaty 7 traditional knowledge keeper to advise on the project. This particular knowledge keeper is a member of a Treaty 7 nation, with particular expertise in indigenous archeology, symbolism, and sacred sites.

• When the art was unveiled, The City’s statements may have left the impression that this was meant to be “indigenous” or “indigenous-inspired” art.

• While it was not The City’s nor the artist’s intent—he has been building similar structures around the world for many decades—some have interpreted the piece as traditional burial scaffolding used by indigenous people in this area. That was not the intent of the artist, and the traditional knowledge keeper did not identify that interpretation when the design was reviewed.

• We therefore acknowledge that The City attempted to be respectful, but that there was a misunderstanding that has led to much discussion, debate and hard feelings. In this time of reconciliation, we believe that it is important to acknowledge what doesn’t work and to move forward with a better way, being always respectful of one another.

Therefore we suggest that:

1. future art projects include more public input, including input from indigenous peoples; and

2. the City of Calgary actively implement ways to involve more indigenous artists, particularly local indigenous artists in its procurement. We note with support the work that the Public Art Program has been doing in this area for the last several months in training artists in how to submit successful bids, and structuring some projects and proposals to be more attractive to emerging artists. We also support that The City of Calgary has set up a committee to explore sharing more indigenous public art in Calgary—a committee that was being developed before this issue was recently raised.

Art should create discussion. We hope that the difficult debate over this piece will strengthen our resolve on creating a more inclusive community for indigenous and non-indigenous people alike.

Signed...

Chief Darcy Dixon
Chief Aaron Young
Chief Roy Fox
Chief Stanley Grier
Chief Joe Weasel Child
Chief Lee Crowchild
Chief Ernest Wesley
Mayor Naheed Nenshi

[suntan]

Only election Nenshi is contrite Nenshi.

Way to throw that city spokesperson under the bus.