Architectural Technologies help

[JC522]

Hey guys, I was considering going back to school and applying for this program at Sait. I've been looking into the program and would like some insight from anyone currently working in this industry or has taken the program at Sait.

1) I've looked at the demand in Alberta for this type of work and it says it's in lower demand. How hard would it be to find a job out of school?
2) Roughly what type of work would I be doing in Calgary with this type of education?
3) The pay I've looked at in ALberta states it's between 25-50$ an hour, realistically what is the pay I would be expecting fresh out of school?
4) The program has a transfer program to Athabasca University for a Bachelor of Science Major in Architecture (4-Year Post Diploma), is this worth pursuing and will it bump the pay by a decent amount?

Thanks for the help and any other information or insight you guys could provide about this field would be greatly appreciated

[The Cosworth]

I can answer your questions 2nd hand because my sister in law does this.

1.) I'd like to clarify that this is the case for all technologists in my opinion. It is harder to find a job because SAIT, NAIT, RDC graduate so many of them as well as since it is 'only' 2 years a lot more people get through and tough it out. However a large component of the people who do 'get through' are not that impressive. How many? Not sure, 50%, 30% I don't really know for sure. However there always seems to be a group of people who can't get jobs and blame that they're a technologist. Not that they're shit. I've had many many many of the same people apply on our postings and we just wont hire them. So even though we're dying for a good technolgoist to hire, there are some without jobs.
1.A.) In response directly to your question about A.T.'s, she hasn't had a problem finding and keeping a job but I don't know if that is typical or because she is good.
2.) Her and all her classmates seem to work for engineering consulting companies (Stantec, AMEC, Knorr, etc). I suspect some end up at developers and home builders and planning departments for muni's.
3.) See #1 for a better explanation. I'd say $30 an hour is a reasonable starting wage. Some technolgoists (not just AT) never break out of that $40 an hour. Some get way way past that. I suspect it is the same here.
4.) No one can answer that for you. It depends on so many things. Are you going to regret it? Are you wanting to just finish? Or do you actually think the drafting and designing is more up your alley than the creating. Examine why it is you're considering this. What are your motivations?

You can have all (or none) of the education in the world and with passion can make a good career and life out of it. Good luck.

[ndhal417]

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Hey guys, I was considering going back to school and applying for this program at Sait. I've been looking into the program and would like some insight from anyone currently working in this industry or has taken the program at Sait.

1) I've looked at the demand in Alberta for this type of work and it says it's in lower demand. How hard would it be to find a job out of school?
I graduated from the program in 2016 with about 160 other students. It wasn't the best time to enter the industry economy wise. Out of the 40-50 students that I had classes with, less than 10 got a job out of school or a currently working in the field. The practicum in the last semester can be a big factor. You have to find a company to intern with for about a week. A few of those who did get a job ended up working for the company that they did their practicum with.
2) Roughly what type of work would I be doing in Calgary with this type of education?
Most people start off doing detailing for engineering companies. You might spend most of your time drawing stairs and small components.
3) The pay I've looked at in ALberta states it's between 25-50$ an hour, realistically what is the pay I would be expecting fresh out of school?
$18 to $25 starting is the range I've heard from friends.
4) The program has a transfer program to Athabasca University for a Bachelor of Science Major in Architecture (4-Year Post Diploma), is this worth pursuing and will it bump the pay by a decent amount?
I didn't look into Athabasca too much myself. I believe that it would still take about 3 to 4 years to complete the Bachelors.
You would still be considered a Architectural Technologist so pay range will most likely be the same. It would be helpful if your looking to get a job outside of Alberta or a masters degree later on.

Thanks for the help and any other information or insight you guys could provide about this field would be greatly appreciated

I recently graduated from the program so I have some recent experience with the AT Diploma. I'll echo what Cos said for 1,2, and 4. I put my answers in blue.

[xxviet]

In a class of 30 ish students back in 2016, only about 4 people got jobs. It's very difficult to get a job even if you know your stuff. If you have connections in the industry its much easier to. Starting wage is around $22.00/hr if I can recall correctly from Gibbs Gauge. Those 4 people where 4.0 GPA students, not to say that you can't get a job without it, I'm saying it's difficult to get hired. Lots of my friends that graduated last year are still unemployed take that as a fair warning. When you get a few years experience under your belt, look into other companies and $30/hr+ is not uncommon.

[GorG]

Hey JC522,
My background is in AT, I went on to get a Bachelors in Urban Studies, and now I’m just in my final year of the M.Arch at the University of Calgary. I worked for five years in the industry as well as every summer during my M.Arch. I pursued my Bachelors while I was working full time. Never had an issue finding work but that’s mainly because I initially landed a gig with an old connection that I had in the industry. That opened up doors for me to other firms.

TL-DR

1. Depends completely on you.

2. Residential, Commercial, Industrial, Estimating, or working for product manufacturers. On the architectural side you’ll be dealing with development permits (maybe if your lucky)/building permits/issued for construction drawing packages, change orders, request for information, site visits, coordinating with consultant drawings (structural, mechanical, electrical). Design is a small fraction of the overall process. Concerning drawings, it's figuring out how everything gets put together that meets code requirements (your best friend).

3. Depending on which part of the industry you specialise in and the size of the firm dictates your pay range. $50/hr you would probably find in a smaller estimating company, $25 would be a medium-sized residential builder/designer. In commercial, I started out in the $30/hr range.

4. Experience is what dictates pay, not necessarily education. Education will help you to land a job easier and opens up more doors depending on what you want to do. See what options are available for the route you want to take. Ultimately if you go to SAIT for the AT program, you have two years to figure it out. If you 're going to be an AT but want something better than just the diploma I would recommend looking into the transfer option for the Bachelors of Project Management offered at SAIT.



For the most part, I would agree with Cosworth said. I would add the following to it.

One thing to consider is that SAIT and all the other polytechnics in Alberta only offer AT as a diploma. Being just a diploma means that you’ll be competing with graduates from other provinces that attained a Bachelors in Architectural Science. That means that you’ll have a slight hill to climb out of the gate. However, if you know your stuff, have a good work ethic, strive to know everything you can about architectural building science, and made connections along the way in your diploma, it shouldn’t be an issue finding a job. Ultimately the suggestion I have kind of ties into question number 4. If you just want to be an Architectural Technologist (Solving problems and coming up with design solutions to make projects work), then I would recommend just trying to get into a University that has a Bachelors of Architectural Building Science (i.e. Ryerson).

http://www.ryerson.ca/programs/under...tural-science/

They have a 4-year or 5-year option. The five year provides you with one year of co-op v.s. SAIT’s 2-week co-op, meaning that you’ll have real-world experience when you finish your degree making you more attractive to potential employers.

I graduated out of SAIT in 2010, most of the people in my program ended up finding jobs, this included residential, commercial, industrial, estimating, or working for product manufacturers. Regarding your second question, that should give you the sense of freedom where you can find work. I took the AT route for two reasons. 1. My grades weren’t good going into the program. I always knew I wanted to get into Architecture, but I took time off after high school, and it didn’t help that I partied a lot in high school either. The AT diploma provided me with the ability to get good grades and to work my way to the M.arch. 2. Because of the connections I made through sales, I knew that I would more than likely have a job waiting for me when I had finished the diploma program. This meant that I could pay my way through my Bachelors and a portion of my Master’s without taking on as much debt.

The firm I worked for was medium sized and specialised in commercial, old age care, and high rise residential. I proved my worth early on and was given more responsibility. Ultimately, I ended up design a few smaller projects, managing my own projects, dealing directly with clients, submitting development permits. It’s pretty rare to get that kind of experience out of a medium-size firm. There is a higher outcome of that in a smaller firm where you need to take on more responsibility to realise a project. Out of the gate, I would avoid large firms as you typically become a gear in a machine, you would likely have one specialisation (i.e. millwork), and you would be stuck there until your either noticed or switch another firm. Also in a larger firm because you have a specific speciality to improve the efficiency of a project it means your easily expendable and won't get the best pay grade.

For the final point, it entirely depends on what you want to do and what your current academic situation is. If you have decent grades and can get into a Bachelors of Architectural Science, then that’s just what I would do; it opens more doors for you initially. If you're older and just want to get an AT program to work in Alberta, then do the SAIT route. If you're like me and don’t have the highest grades initially, get the AT program then move on to something else other than the Bachelor of Science Major in Architecture. I went with Urban studies however in hindsight I wish I got a Bachelors in Structural/Mechanical/Electrical Engineering. That makes you that much more desirable and the type of work you could be doing. Also when I finished my AT diploma they didn’t have it at the time, but now SAIT offer's a 3-year transfer option into a Bachelors of Project Management, giving you a significant advantage to anyone else leaving the AT program or even someone with a BArchSc.

Anyways, good luck.

[JC522]

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Hey JC522,
My background is in AT, I went on to get a Bachelors in Urban Studies, and now I’m just in my final year of the M.Arch at the University of Calgary. I worked for five years in the industry as well as every summer during my M.Arch. I pursued my Bachelors while I was working full time. Never had an issue finding work but that’s mainly because I initially landed a gig with an old connection that I had in the industry. That opened up doors for me to other firms.

TL-DR

1. Depends completely on you.

2. Residential, Commercial, Industrial, Estimating, or working for product manufacturers. On the architectural side you’ll be dealing with development permits (maybe if your lucky)/building permits/issued for construction drawing packages, change orders, request for information, site visits, coordinating with consultant drawings (structural, mechanical, electrical). Design is a small fraction of the overall process. Concerning drawings, it's figuring out how everything gets put together that meets code requirements (your best friend).

3. Depending on which part of the industry you specialise in and the size of the firm dictates your pay range. $50/hr you would probably find in a smaller estimating company, $25 would be a medium-sized residential builder/designer. In commercial, I started out in the $30/hr range.

4. Experience is what dictates pay, not necessarily education. Education will help you to land a job easier and opens up more doors depending on what you want to do. See what options are available for the route you want to take. Ultimately if you go to SAIT for the AT program, you have two years to figure it out. If you 're going to be an AT but want something better than just the diploma I would recommend looking into the transfer option for the Bachelors of Project Management offered at SAIT.



For the most part, I would agree with Cosworth said. I would add the following to it.

One thing to consider is that SAIT and all the other polytechnics in Alberta only offer AT as a diploma. Being just a diploma means that you’ll be competing with graduates from other provinces that attained a Bachelors in Architectural Science. That means that you’ll have a slight hill to climb out of the gate. However, if you know your stuff, have a good work ethic, strive to know everything you can about architectural building science, and made connections along the way in your diploma, it shouldn’t be an issue finding a job. Ultimately the suggestion I have kind of ties into question number 4. If you just want to be an Architectural Technologist (Solving problems and coming up with design solutions to make projects work), then I would recommend just trying to get into a University that has a Bachelors of Architectural Building Science (i.e. Ryerson).

http://www.ryerson.ca/programs/under...tural-science/

They have a 4-year or 5-year option. The five year provides you with one year of co-op v.s. SAIT’s 2-week co-op, meaning that you’ll have real-world experience when you finish your degree making you more attractive to potential employers.

I graduated out of SAIT in 2010, most of the people in my program ended up finding jobs, this included residential, commercial, industrial, estimating, or working for product manufacturers. Regarding your second question, that should give you the sense of freedom where you can find work. I took the AT route for two reasons. 1. My grades weren’t good going into the program. I always knew I wanted to get into Architecture, but I took time off after high school, and it didn’t help that I partied a lot in high school either. The AT diploma provided me with the ability to get good grades and to work my way to the M.arch. 2. Because of the connections I made through sales, I knew that I would more than likely have a job waiting for me when I had finished the diploma program. This meant that I could pay my way through my Bachelors and a portion of my Master’s without taking on as much debt.

The firm I worked for was medium sized and specialised in commercial, old age care, and high rise residential. I proved my worth early on and was given more responsibility. Ultimately, I ended up design a few smaller projects, managing my own projects, dealing directly with clients, submitting development permits. It’s pretty rare to get that kind of experience out of a medium-size firm. There is a higher outcome of that in a smaller firm where you need to take on more responsibility to realise a project. Out of the gate, I would avoid large firms as you typically become a gear in a machine, you would likely have one specialisation (i.e. millwork), and you would be stuck there until your either noticed or switch another firm. Also in a larger firm because you have a specific speciality to improve the efficiency of a project it means your easily expendable and won't get the best pay grade.

For the final point, it entirely depends on what you want to do and what your current academic situation is. If you have decent grades and can get into a Bachelors of Architectural Science, then that’s just what I would do; it opens more doors for you initially. If you're older and just want to get an AT program to work in Alberta, then do the SAIT route. If you're like me and don’t have the highest grades initially, get the AT program then move on to something else other than the Bachelor of Science Major in Architecture. I went with Urban studies however in hindsight I wish I got a Bachelors in Structural/Mechanical/Electrical Engineering. That makes you that much more desirable and the type of work you could be doing. Also when I finished my AT diploma they didn’t have it at the time, but now SAIT offer's a 3-year transfer option into a Bachelors of Project Management, giving you a significant advantage to anyone else leaving the AT program or even someone with a BArchSc.

Anyways, good luck.

Thanks for that. I'm actually older, I'm 31 years old now. I would try to get directly into university but unfortunately my grades weren't that great in highschool, sitting in the 70s which I understand isn't competitive these days. I would like to eventually get into the M.Arch program at the university as well. My plan was to complete this program at sait, do the transfer program at Athabasca, then apply to UofC but you stated to stay away from the Bachelor of Science major in Architecture. How exactly did you go from this program to the M.Arch program?

My older sister is a civil p.engg and I was hoping she would have some contacts for me in the industry when the time comes. She has worked for stantec before and told me they hired ATs.

[adidas]

If I was in your shoes this is what I would do.

Complete your undergraduate degree at the University of Calgary in an area of study that you enjoy. Maintain a high GPA and transfer to the Faculty of Environmental Design to complete your M.Arch. I would forgo the SAIT + Athabasca programs and stick with the more traditional route(s). At the end of the day, it will be much easier for you to transfer and you will get preferential treatment seeing how you are already a UofC student. Most M.Arch program transfers pick an area of study closely related to architecture that blends in with their creative side + the environment (ie. Geography, Urban Studies, Art History).

SAIT is fantastic at providing you with the required knowledge (fundemental construction design, CAD drafting, interpreting NBC/ABC, introductory physics) for you to producer on day 1 at your new firm however, the AT diploma is very limiting if you are looking to work for the big guys in town (ie. Gibbs Gage, IBI Group, Dialog). From what I have been told, most AT graduates will typically detail drawings, staircases and other generally miniscule tasks. If you are looking to point your finger at a building in the future and say "I designed that", a B.Arch or M.Arch is what you are after. AT graduates are limited in what they can design as specified by the National Building Code, it must be a wood structure, under 3 stories, <6,000 sq. ft., etc.

What you should also look into is to complete a B.Arch, I believe Univ of Manitoba and McGill Univ offer undergraduate programs in architecture. As it stands, the M.Arch would take you 7 years to complete, (4 undergrad years + 3 graduate years), you can eliminate that by doing the B.Arch directly. If you do go down the Athabasca path, ensure that their program is accredited with the RAIC.

Edit: I just checked the RAIC's website and Athabasca's program is not accredited.
https://www.raic.org/raic/canadian-u...s-architecture

[88CRX]

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Hey guys, I was considering going back to school and applying for this program at Sait. I've been looking into the program and would like some insight from anyone currently working in this industry or has taken the program at Sait.

1) I've looked at the demand in Alberta for this type of work and it says it's in lower demand. How hard would it be to find a job out of school?
2) Roughly what type of work would I be doing in Calgary with this type of education?
3) The pay I've looked at in ALberta states it's between 25-50$ an hour, realistically what is the pay I would be expecting fresh out of school?
4) The program has a transfer program to Athabasca University for a Bachelor of Science Major in Architecture (4-Year Post Diploma), is this worth pursuing and will it bump the pay by a decent amount?

Thanks for the help and any other information or insight you guys could provide about this field would be greatly appreciated

Been doing AT work for the past 13-14 years strictly at Architectural firms and I dont remember the last time I was not 'busy'. Couple thoughts and answers to your questions:

- All my classmates got work immediately out of school (in 2004) and have kept work since graduating.
- $25/hour would be fair starting pay, might actually end up being less than that. Should be able to grow from there. Coming out of school in 04' we all got job offers under $30k haha. Like $15/hour.
- Try and get on somewhere for your work week and potentially a summer job at a larger arch. firm (to get your foot in the door and to get some experience).
- It is a lot of tweaking stuff that is already drawn and not a ton of drawing from scratch.
- If you want to do design work make that clear, most AT's don't get a sniff at doing any real design work. Especially true at the larger shops, you might just be drawing details for the first while.
- If you can't get a summer job doing AT/Drafting work get on with a construction company doing framing work! Invaluable experience that most AT's have no clue about.
- Based on how much more school is required to become an 'architecture' and based on the salaries I've seen I would not recommend it. I graduated with AT's that went back to school to become architects and when they started getting jobs, making junior salary I already had 4-5 years of experience, raises and promotions. Honestly some of them were being managed by myself and other AT's when they came out of school. The only real payoff as a true architect is being able to run your own shop and stamp/sign drawings. AT's obviously can't do that.
- Have had lots of AT coworkers jump ship to join developer companies or general contractors (estimators, PM's, etc) so lots of ability to change it up in the future.

[ctochico]

i've been working for about 12 yrs now as well, i graduated with an undergrad degree in winnipeg, and obviously the wage there is much less. i got recruited to work in calgary almost 4 years ago by a global company, and lets just say...it was the salary that convinced me, my net pay here is more than my gross pay back home. but i do mis the jets!! #gojetsgo not too sure what starting wage is these days, we just hired a junior, and hes 20 yrs old from sait program...im guessing hes at $40-$50k? i started doing basic drafting in the beginning, but as you gain experience, you do more construction documents, technical detailing, job captaining/project coordinating, 3d renderings as well. projects dependant on company, i've been doing big commercial buidlings, senior homes, fire halls etc, all range from $10mil-&100mil projects.

it may be from my experiences/projects that i have and worked on, but i have recruiters contacting me at least once a week...so seems like the job market is picking up.

[ercchry]

Such a frustrating industry... expect to do 90% of an engineer’s job at 1/3-1/2 the pay... I don’t miss it

Want more money? Try to do piping instead... but then you get laid off every downturn... no real winning, go for the ring, eng is were it’s at... or do what cosworth does