Kids with adults at a all nude swim. Yes or no?

[ExtraSlow]

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Who's forcing kids to go to this thing?

Allowing children means that some family COULD force their kids to go.

It's not impossible that it could happen. So therefore it should be legislated against for all families.

[Mitsu3000gt]

Fuck no, this type of event would be a dream come true for pedo's. If it was just adults, then fine who cares. Glad it got canceled given that they were going to allow kids.

[MalibuStacy]

So, just a thought here...

Everyone has a body and everyone is a body. Being naked and sexuality are not intrinsically linked. Being clothed only developed as a means to protect ourselves from the elements (go take anthro 201/203 or soci 201).

I don't disagree with some of you thoughts and opinions and ideas on how a 12 year old cannot necessarily comprehend consent. This is valid. But to link their nudity with sexuality is a bit askew...

In relation to that, all the talk of pedophiles and bad people a this event. Can it be completely avoided, no; but this is privately held event hosted at a public facility. Where they have your ID and contact information. It is not a walk in walk out event. Closed doors and so on. Yes there is an slightly increased chance someone could be deviant as it is a nude event simply due to the fact that our society unfortunately relates nudity to sex. But for someone to be so bold to assault some one at this event is a big step especially since it restricted paid entry and it is a private event. Plus the CoC pools all have very strict rules on underage children/parent rule (must be within arms reach) and a zero camera policy on deck and in change rooms. Now lets say someone who is a pedophile does decide to go to this event and DOES NOT DO ANYTHING DEVIANT AT THE EVENT, but then goes home and whacks on off because of what they saw; is it deviant, yes, but unfortunately there is really nothing we can do about this and it would happen regardless of whether a small slip of fabric was covering something or not.

Also as has been said by a few people on this forum, many of the people going to the event will likely already have had a naturalist/nudist culture existing in their home. Our popular culture (Hollywood) has made it seem as if parents and children being nude is odd or weird. But if you actually work with young children and observe early childhood development you can see that many children really have no concept of nudity, up till about the age of 5 some don't even know what gender is because gender is learned and developed. All these issues of what a child considers normal is purely dependant on what the parent considers normal.

Now to address the troller (Gestalt), troll on. And to troll Firebane, I'm sorry your freedom to become a individual who identifies with the gender of pink unicorn was oppressed by your parents.

Basically this event has made a mountain of a mole hill and it really speaks to how hung up our nation is on body image and sex...still.

[HiTempguy1]

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Being naked and sexuality are not intrinsically linked.
...
up till about the age of 5 some don't even know what gender is because gender is learned and developed
...
All these issues of what a child considers normal is purely dependant on what the parent considers normal.

Good lord Drinking that kool-aid reaaaalllllllyyyyy hard eh?

While your gender and women studies may have "taught" you this, there is plenty of research to the contrary. Your feelings don't make it fact haha.

Edit-

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Who's forcing kids to go to this thing?

Its the same argument made against religion Except one requires sitting quietly in a building, not getting naked in front of strangers.

Do you really think the kids are just pumped to be going? That they wanted to go?

Understand, I don't think its a big deal for young kids really (under 5). This isn't about anything physical, more about the psychological implications. I fairly strongly object to most things that are indoctrinating, but have to be realistic about it.

Fucking hell, go on a porn site, and half the stuff is about daddy/mommy/brother/sister shit

[ExtraSlow]

What's really interesting in this thread is that even when you take out the trolls and idiots, it's obvious that seemingly reasonably people have extremely differing views on nudity in a family environment and the best way to ensure safety for children. I don't think we're going to have a productive conversation on these topics in these forums, or anywhere else on the internet, but it's always helpful to keep in mind the wide variety of opinions we all hold.

[dandia89]

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What's really interesting in this thread is that even when you take out the trolls and idiots, it's obvious that seemingly reasonably people have extremely differing views on nudity in a family environment and the best way to ensure safety for children. I don't think we're going to have a productive conversation on these topics in these forums, or anywhere else on the internet, but it's always helpful to keep in mind the wide variety of opinions we all hold.

I'm guessing this division is only really common in north american culture. While it seems like european would have no problem with this. I wonder if people who've lived in other countries notice how bizarre we perceive nudity.

[MalibuStacy]

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Good lord Drinking that kool-aid reaaaalllllllyyyyy hard eh?

While your gender and women studies may have "taught" you this, there is plenty of research to the contrary. Your feelings don't make it fact haha.

Well that's just it, there is always research to go against anything anyone says, it often drives human research. I'm just simply providing a side to the debate. I'm liberal so really nothing is fact.

[Aleks]

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Fuck no, this type of event would be a dream come true for pedo's. If it was just adults, then fine who cares. Glad it got canceled given that they were going to allow kids.

These events have been going on for 20-30 years. Like I said once the social media outrage subsides it will continue. Calgary's event was cancelled due to parking lot "safety" concerns.

https://edmonton.ctvnews.ca/edmonton...lled-1.3759098

[MalibuStacy]

I like the rabble in this thread

[suntan]

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Good lord Drinking that kool-aid reaaaalllllllyyyyy hard eh?

While your gender and women studies may have "taught" you this, there is plenty of research to the contrary. Your feelings don't make it fact haha.

So in your weird little world, change rooms are also sexual, because there are naked people in them? Sometimes they even shower together naked. So sexy.

Gender is almost entirely a social construct. Yes sorry to piss you off but that's the way the dick points.

[a social dsease]

I voted yes - it should be allowed. While it's not an event that I personally would attend (with or without my kids), I'm a big proponent of individuals being allowed to make their own choices and live their own lives (as long as they are not harming others). There's clearly no explicit harm being done to kids (or anyone) therefore this event should be allowed to proceed. If you don't like it, then don't attend, it's that simple. But, similarly to drug legalization or abortion, don't try to tell others what they can/can't do with their own bodies.

[firebane]

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I'm a big proponent of individuals being allowed to make their own choices and live their own lives (as long as they are not harming others). There's clearly no explicit harm being done to kids (or anyone) therefore this event should be allowed to proceed.

So you believe a 5 year old or a 9 year can make a proper decision to attend these events and have all the proper knowledge to understand everything about it?

[Ca_Silvia13]

Assuming by the comments thus far no one heard the interview on x929 on Friday were they interviewed the organiser? He covered a lot of these points from his/the business side of things. Couple things that really stuck out for me was:

They rent these facilities like anyone else can public or not. They black out the windows, take ID and hire security.

If you are going around pointing and obviously just checking people out (ie. creep) you will be asked to leave and escorted out.

If you walk around with a fucking hard on the whole time. You will be escorted out or worse jumped by a bunch of naked dudes.

If you stand in a corner staring at people like a fucking creep. You will be escorted out.

He said he had to to make it "all ages" as when you put something like this one and make it 18+. It sets the wrong tone. Everyone then assume it just going to be a big orgy. Which was the exact opposite of what it is.


And the fact they have run these successfully in Edmonton for a while is just embarrassing for Calgary. I honestly thought we were way more open minded than this in Calgary.

[firebane]

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Assuming by the comments thus far no one heard the interview on x929 on Friday were they interviewed the organiser? He covered a lot of these points from his/the business side of things. Couple things that really stuck out for me was:

They rent these facilities like anyone else can public or not. They black out the windows, take ID and hire security.

If you are going around pointing and obviously just checking people out (ie. creep) you will be asked to leave and escorted out.

If you walk around with a fucking hard on the whole time. You will be escorted out or worse jumped by a bunch of naked dudes.

If you stand in a corner staring at people like a fucking creep. You will be escorted out.

He said he had to to make it "all ages" as when you put something like this one and make it 18+. It sets the wrong tone. Everyone then assume it just going to be a big orgy. Which was the exact opposite of what it is.


I honestly thought we were way more open minded than this in Calgary.

I really hope your being sarcastic here. I have lived in Calgary for about 6 years and I don't consider it "open minded". I have never even heard the term NIMBY until I moved here.

I remember one time a guy was harassing a woman at City Hall train station and as I walked by I told the guy to leave her alone and mind his own business. He followed me for 2 blocks screaming I touch children and that I am a pedophile.

Yup classy Calgary.

[jwslam]

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So you believe a 5 year old or a 9 year can make a proper decision to attend these events and have all the proper knowledge to understand everything about it?

Similar question, but replace this event with Church Mass.

[ExtraSlow]

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So you believe a 5 year old or a 9 year can make a proper decision to attend these events and have all the proper knowledge to understand everything about it?

I don't think a 5 year old has the mental capability to give informed consent to any activity. They can't "proper knowledge to understand everything about" ; summer camps, hockey practice, visiting the dentist or riding thier bike. If that's the standard that activities have to meet then you'd better outlaw everything for kids.

Firebane, clearly you had some issues with activities that you were forced to attend as a child, and that's terrible, but at some point, you have to give the parents some responsibility and leeway to make decisions for their children. The amount of leeway and the specific activities that are acceptable by society change over time, and usually those changes are made with the intention of reducing the risk of harm to kids. The fact is that nudism doesn't appeal to very many people, but it's not illegal, and as far as I know, there's no documented higher risk to children compared to other events.

[a social dsease]

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So you believe a 5 year old or a 9 year can make a proper decision to attend these events and have all the proper knowledge to understand everything about it?

I believe parents should be allowed to raise their children as they see fit (even if I may not agree with every parenting decision they make), as long as there is no explicit harm to the child. To draw an analogy, if you decided to only feed your kids McDonalds, while I don't think that is the healthiest decision, since you aren't explicitly harming them (ie feeding them poisonous chemicals) I think you should be allowed to do so - it's your decision what to feed them, not my decision.

In the swimming pool case, there is clearly no explicit harm to the child. It's a nude SWIM, not a f*cking gang-bang..... Therefore, parents should be allowed to make the decision to either take their child, or not take their child. I have no right to restrict their decision, unless there is clearly explicit harm being done to the children (which there isn't).

[msommers]

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I really hope your being sarcastic here. I have lived in Calgary for about 6 years and I don't consider it "open minded". I have never even heard the term NIMBY until I moved here.

I remember one time a guy was harassing a woman at City Hall train station and as I walked by I told the guy to leave her alone and mind his own business. He followed me for 2 blocks screaming I touch children and that I am a pedophile.

Yup classy Calgary.

One shitty thing has happened to you once in 6 years and that's your conclusion?

Anyways, I'm kind of surprised these events would be organized in the first place. When I think of public nudity not being a big deal, it's literally anywhere but North America -- North Americas generally speaking are pretty prudish when it comes to their bodies. Until they hit 60+ and sit naked together on the leather couches at the Y watching TV for an hour.

Here's some food for thought. If Pedos were lining up at the door for these events (and this isn't the first event hosted, just the first that has received so much public distress), they'd be going already. Additionally, they'd be sitting in the change room all day just watching people. How often does that happen?

Everyone was freaking out about camera phones when they first came out, thinking that pervs would be in there all day snapping photos and now look, no one gives a shit.

According to a few of you in here, we should just follow Antoine's advice:

[Hallowed_point]

I don't think anyone would rape my kid or hypothetical kid. But I do think the likelyhood of some creep jerking it or getting excited negates any possible "gain"

But I'll bet my lotus land friends back on Vancouver Island would be appalled at my response. it's like getting back to nature man..

[Seth1968]

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So you believe a 5 year old or a 9 year can make a proper decision to attend these events and have all the proper knowledge to understand everything about it?

What's there to understand other than teaching kids and adults not to be ashamed of their body, and not to physically judge others? That's a healthy position to take, unlike the destructive position that 99% of kids are forced to believe. I already elaborated on that in a previous post.