Inexpensive Electric Cars - All brands discussion.

[killramos]

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@benyl said it best, it’s not a luxury car. It’s a fast econobox, like STI or EVO. I think the only people that position Tesla as a luxury car are the ones buying such an expensive car for the first time, coming from 10+ year old even bigger shit boxes. The ones that get wet over the brake hold feature haha.

Or reviewers who want to quote that they sold more than *insert luxo brand here* because their numbers don’t look so hot when they hit in their weight class of domestic econoboxes.

“Tesla outsold Bugatti last quarter: Why that’s a big deal”

[heavyD]

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@benyl said it best, it’s not a luxury car. It’s a fast econobox, like STI or EVO. I think the only people that position Tesla as a luxury car are the ones buying such an expensive car for the first time, coming from 10+ year old even bigger shit boxes. The ones that get wet over the brake hold feature haha.

It never gets old seeing Tesla fans gush about the amazing tech. A lot of them actually believe Teslas are the pinnacle of high tech in automobiles. I just assume these people have come from entry level equipped economy cars.

[zieg]

I just wish other manufacturers would stop trying to make their EVs seem super high tech/futuristic. IMO a giant touchscreen taking the place of physical buttons for things like radio and hvac is just asinine. Between that and the dumbass door handles there's no way I could own a mach e.

The blazer looks promising but I'm a bit iffy on its touchscreen situation. Also interested in the solterra but I'd have to drive it first to see if the weird cluster placement gets on my nerves.

One of the reasons I hate touchscreens is thanks to the shared company car I sometimes had to use at a previous employer. It had some capacitive touch controls that sadly had stopped working, and the only other way to turn the heat on was the touchscreen. Unfortunately the touchscreen wouldn't respond when it was really, really cold, so we were all driving the fucking thing around without heat in the middle of winter.

[killramos]

I wish the spaceship trend would leave the auto sector altogether.

Some of the design language today is bizarre and cringe.

I tried to buy a new Lexus of all things earlier in the year and they locked all the features behind a touch screen and locked my wife in the car 3 times with a electronic door handles. Heated seats are basically the only thing my wife cares about in a car and they screwed it up buy it taking even the salesman several minutes to turn them on.

The answer to it all so pretty simple. Computerized crap is way cheaper to make than something with physical buttons.

[flipstah]

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Q4 is basically a rebadged ID4. I don't think think the rebate applies to the Sportback model tho.

Rebate for purchase or lease but pro-rate based on duration of the lease.

Apparently the ID4 has shitty infotainment so hoping Audi MMI took care of this.

Also looks marginally better than the ID4

[bjstare]

Isn't the ID4 regarded as having a shitty... everything? I recall seeing a review or two that say it's awful.

[r3ccOs]

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I wish the spaceship trend would leave the auto sector altogether.

Some of the design language today is bizarre and cringe.

I tried to buy a new Lexus of all things earlier in the year and they locked all the features behind a touch screen and locked my wife in the car 3 times with a electronic door handles. Heated seats are basically the only thing my wife cares about in a car and they screwed it up buy it taking even the salesman several minutes to turn them on.

The answer to it all so pretty simple. Computerized crap is way cheaper to make than something with physical buttons.

I actually do agree..

Other than the entertainment unit and HVAC, WTF is the difference in an Electric car vs. a Golf Cart or Powerwheels?

[rage2]

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IMO a giant touchscreen taking the place of physical buttons for things like radio and hvac is just asinine.

Agreed. People will call us out for boomer mentality, but using touchscreen, even CarPlay, is a distraction. There’s a reason why distracted driving laws exist. I’m actually surprised that touchscreens for basic functionality is an approved thing.

Touchscreens are great when you’re a passenger, terrible when you’re driving.

[r3ccOs]

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Agreed. People will call us out for boomer mentality, but using touchscreen, even CarPlay, is a distraction. There’s a reason why distracted driving laws exist. I’m actually surprised that touchscreens for basic functionality is an approved thing.

Touchscreens are great when you’re a passenger, terrible when you’re driving.

I've not been more scared of riding a motorcycle within city limits since the release of the iphone.

its one thing to t9, another to have to look and type to text

[heavyD]

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Agreed. People will call us out for boomer mentality, but using touchscreen, even CarPlay, is a distraction. There’s a reason why distracted driving laws exist. I’m actually surprised that touchscreens for basic functionality is an approved thing.

Touchscreens are great when you’re a passenger, terrible when you’re driving.

Owning a Tesla basically forces you to become familiar with the voice commands as it's the only efficient way to use controls (not available on the steering wheel) while driving. To Tesla's credit they are generally pretty good compared to legacy automakers that still have issues getting voice recognition right.

[flipstah]

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Owning a Tesla basically forces you to become familiar with the voice commands as it's the only efficient way to use controls (not available on the steering wheel) while driving. To Tesla's credit they are generally pretty good compared to legacy automakers that still have issues getting voice recognition right.

Yes. I had to go through menus to change airflow/mirrors/steering wheel... Things that could've been easily done at a stop light is now through voice commands.

[Kloubek]

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@benyl said it best, it’s not a luxury car. It’s a fast econobox

I agree that's what most Tesla's actually ARE, yet, that's not how most view them - including enthusiast articles and websites. I also agree that the moniker is largely due to the higher price of Teslas, which put them in a league with luxury vehicles based on price alone if nothing else. Even if one takes out the idea that it's a luxury car, I've seen far better build quality on true econoboxes so it's quite unacceptable regardless of one's opinion on what constitutes a "luxury" vehicle. If I'm paying 50-100g on a vehicle, I expect a build quality that exceeds what a drunk, blind, and paraplegic Mexican could throw together in a weekend.

[zieg]

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a build quality that exceeds what a drunk, blind, and paraplegic Mexican could throw together in a weekend.

Ah, I see you have also owned a 1991 Ford Explorer

[LilDrunkenSmurf]

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Ah, I see you have also owned a 1991 Ford Explorer

Yeah, and he misses the build quality.

[DonJuan]

If Kloubek is complaining about build quality on Tesla's it's REALLY bad.

I saw a youtube video explaining that Tesla's like to snap welded motor mounts when launching often. Which means don't buy former rental cars

[heavyD]

The build quality is the worst I have ever seen with any car I have ever owned. The paint on mine isn't terrible but there are more dust specs under it than on any car I have owned. The panel gaps on mine aren't nearly as bad as some of the horror story photos you see on the web but it's still worse than any other car I have owned as I have a gap on my rear bumper cover that's not correctable without changing the bumper cover (poor molding process) and one of the front fenders was not aligned (I fixed myself by removing the wheel well plastic and pulling out the fender). I was actually pleasantly surprised that my interior was pretty solid as the headliner didn't have any gaps at the pillars and the trim generally lines up but there's a tin can feel inside when you are driving with all the random creaks and rattles. Tesla has improved but the bar is still low as they went from garage kit car level fit and finish on their early cars to what it is now which still wouldn't be good enough for Chrysler or Lotus.

[benyl]

I have a sample size of 2. Build quality in 2019 wasn't terrible. I think the issues are overblown because of the price of the cars. People expect more. People who buy a $30K car buy it as an appliance. I doubt they check panel gap sizes.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/8QlzjwGTZRc

[heavyD]

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I have a sample size of 2. Build quality in 2019 wasn't terrible. I think the issues are overblown because of the price of the cars. People expect more. People who buy a $30K car buy it as an appliance. I doubt they check panel gap sizes.

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/8QlzjwGTZRc

I don't agree that they are overblown. Now all brands let the odd car go out with some issues but with Tesla it's the opposite in that the odd car may come out of the assembly line nearly perfect and the majority all come off the assembly line flawed to a degree. I haven't seen cheap economy cars with the level if imperfections of Teslas. I actually think most people in general don't check panel gaps on any cars that aren't very expensive or enthusiast. The reality is that the majority of Tesla owners don't seem to care about panel gaps which is why Tesla has got away with poor build quality for so long. If you just walk around my Model 3P you would assume that it looks pretty well built. When you start looking closer and comparing to other cars is where the faults pop up. In my garage parked next to my wife's new GV70 the Genesis panels, paint, and overall quality is night and day better.

I installed some mud flaps and the front and rear wheel well liners on the Tesla doesn't even really fit properly as there are lots of gaps and stretching to get clips to fit. The fitment of all panels in general is very sloppy as I have taken apart a lot of cars over the decades and the panel fitment on these cars inside and out is worse than old Chrysler K car era. A lot of people just don't care about stuff like this and that's fine but if you do care, you will have to be okay with a level of quality below what you are used to.

[msommers]

Whether people notice or not, for a significant proportion of Tesla owners it's a brand statement and/or "In Elon We Trust" so any criticisms would be futile or justified.

[flipstah]

Just saw a KIA EV6 in person and it's a looker in matte gray. I dig it.

Not as sharp as the Hyundai one.