Inexpensive Electric Cars - All brands discussion.

[ExtraSlow]

Now I'm not currently in the market, but I am fascinated by this topic. If a person wanted a pure electric vehicle for running around town, taking the kids to school, getting groceries, commuting etc, what's the hot choice if you aren't rich? I see an electric Ford Focus is around $38k, and Chev Bolt, Kia Soul, Nissan Leaf and VW e-Golf for around that same price. If I'm reading the Tesla website right, the cheapest model is $64k, so let's leave them out of it.

Anyone more knowledgeable than me on this topic? Any of these cars have a clear range or sportiness or charge speed advantage?

EDIT: Chev Bolt, Not Volt.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[rage2]

Bolt is terrible from a financials perspective. The lease rates are brutal. Buying any EV in Alberta sucks right now if you’re looking to make financial sense as we have zero government incentives.

[killramos]

I kindof like the e golf, it’s the only ev that isn’t entirely full of itself.

It’s just a golf, that is electric. And looks great.

35k isn’t even that bad these days, every econobox is crack money these days.

[rage2]

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I kindof like the e golf, it’s the only ev that isn’t entirely full of itself.

It’s just a golf, that is electric. And looks great.

35k isn’t even that bad these days, every econobox is crack money these days.

A gas powered golf with the same trim line costs $11k less. Depending on driving distance, it takes 4-6 years to make up that difference in fuel costs to break even on TCO in Alberta. Without government incentives to close the costs gap of an electric drivetrain, it’s not really viable from a financial perspective today.

The only reason you should buy an EV here is to be full of yourself for pretending to save the environment, which is precisely why the e golf isn’t popular at all.

In BC, that gap drops to 2-3 years. In Ontario (before it was scrapped), you were ahead of the game from day 1. Keeping things simple with my math, not counting oil changes for gas cars or electric wiring costs in your home for EV.

[Aleks]

What about used? EVs have some very poor resale value so you could score a good deal if you can find one as supply in AB is limited.

[ExtraSlow]

I get that EV's in Alberta don't make financial sense, a much cheaper gas car is hard to argue against.

Still, EV's have other merits, including reduced maintence, quiet operation, and yes, image that some people covet.

The egolf seems interesting, although it's slow. I love the golf shape.

Kijiji Calgary has zero used EV's right now, so I assume they are rare as hell.

[Xtrema]

Just found out that Fiat 500e is RIV approved. Off lease ones are dirt cheap from US. They lose like 70% of value in 3 years. If the CAD worth more, not a bad city car assuming you can import one for around $13K CAD with 1-2 years of warranty left.

But it only has 84mile range since it's pretty much a Cali compliance car, so it's definitely a lot more limited in the use case.

Until Kona EV/eNiro twins come our way, I think eGolf is probably the best "cheap" EV of the bunch.

Charge speed wise, it doesn't matter. If you don't have a Tesla, you are stuck charging in the garage and home anyway. Just get a 240V dryer outlet out there for the most efficient charging. Even if you can charge off 110V, it's 20% less efficient than 240V

Speaking of charging at Condos, looks like the fight has started.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calga...arge-1.4862723

[ZenOps]

China will eventually get around to it. They will also soon be producing electric bikes so cheaply that people will just leave them on the streets unlocked.

Then it all changes.

[ExtraSlow]

84 miles is on the short end, but realistically, I could go from my house in north Calgary to the Okotoks "big rock" and back on a charge, and that's decent. Maybe you'd want a little more margin to handle less than ideal winter conditions, although when it's cold as hell, a lot of city dwellers don't go far anyway.

I still say that range isn't a big deal for a family that has a second vehicle, which is most of them around here.

[rage2]

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What about used? EVs have some very poor resale value so you could score a good deal if you can find one as supply in AB is limited.

Yup, used is a way to go. Some EVs you have to be careful with, such as Leafs which had terrible battery degradation.

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Still, EV's have other merits, including reduced maintence, quiet operation, and yes, image that some people covet.

Reduced maintenance is sort of a myth. Oil changes are cheap, and really that's the only thing you're not doing with an EV. The difference is negligible. If anything, the reduced brake wear has more of a maintenance cost savings than oil changes. All that is negated in the long term once it's time to replace the battery (assuming you're owning the car for long term). Tesla is an outlier as well as their yearly maintenance costs are currently higher than any car I've owned including AMGs.

[Xtrema]

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Reduced maintenance is sort of a myth. Oil changes are cheap, and really that's the only thing you're not doing with an EV. The difference is negligible. If anything, the reduced brake wear has more of a maintenance cost savings than oil changes. All that is negated in the long term once it's time to replace the battery (assuming you're owning the car for long term). Tesla is an outlier as well as their yearly maintenance costs are currently higher than any car I've owned including AMGs.

Also, Nissan also raised the price for battery replacement for 1st Gen Leaf owners from $5500USD to $8500USD. That's a lot of oil changes and brake pad replacements on a equivalent Nissan Versa and may even cover a failed CVT replacement cost in there.

https://www.mynissanleaf.com/viewtopic.php?t=25882

So unless a safe aftermarket support comes in, the whole batteries get cheaper over time argument is bunk. Although in Nissan's case, it's probably planned obsolescence.

And given limited source of mining for battery material to be had, I think battery prices will hold at current rate for a long time to come if not running into shortages if EV growth continues.

[rage2]

Battery costs are going down, that's a fact. Nissan charging more is like you said probably planned obsolescence.

[Tik-Tok]

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The only reason you should buy an EV here is to be full of yourself for pretending to save the environment, which is precisely why the e golf isn’t popular at all.

I just like to be part of the soluuuutionnn.

[Aleks]

I would consider one for my commute to work if we had that $14,000 inventive like they did in Ontario. I have free charging at work so that would have made getting an e-Golf in the mid 20k range very attractive.

[nzwasp]

How long does one of these cars take to charge from 0% to full battery?

[rage2]

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How long does one of these cars take to charge from 0% to full battery?

Home Chargers:



Basically with a Level 2 220V charger, you're good to go for nightly top ups.

[nzwasp]

So the Ikea chargers are actually near the top of the range. I never see anyone using them though.

[rage2]

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So the Ikea chargers are actually near the top of the range. I never see anyone using them though.

There's not a lot of reasons to go out and charge. EVs really change the workflow of "refueling". Gas cars, you drive till it's empty, go out, and refuel. EV's, you charge every night when you get home, so it's always full. You would only use outside chargers when doing long trips.

90% of driving really is covered by home charging, this is why we won't and don't need to match gas stations when it comes to chargers, except on highways.

[killramos]

Using the cars idle time to charge is definitely key.

The 4-5 supercharger model per city and periodically along major routes is probably totally sufficient if 95% of charging is done at home.

EV charging stations is just virtue posturing by malls, buildings etc.

My last building had “EV Charging” you had to go park in the loading dock next to the trash cans though , 2 whole charging points too lol. There was always some smug bastard with a Tesla there.