Cellular Device Subsidy - Are you getting ripped off?

[syscal]

https://globalnews.ca/news/5070281/c...evice-subsidy/

Had this happen with our business plan with Rogers. Nine phones, and I guess we were paying for the subsidy on a couple last year that were past the two year mark. I think we got some sort of rate change but not a credit. We only go with the $15/mth subsidy, so not a huge deal, but I know on the upper end of the subsidy you can be paying quite a bit more.

We had something similar with TD Bank as well, can't remember the exact situation but rep told us of a rate change of some type that occurred something like 18 months ago, and he can make the change now to save us some money. I asked why he didn't tell us about it and he said "I can't go up and down my list of clients every time rates change". We ended up getting a good credit back on that one, but still switched banks.

Both companies acting like they're using paper and not databases and we, the consumer, are to blame for not thinking of these things or assuming that any of these huge publicly traded organizations might actually have some integrity.

[ExtraSlow]

For Cellphones, if you are at or over your 2-years, and you don't want a new device, LEAVE your current provider and come to public mobile. More details in the cellphone plans thread.

[Xtrema]

Well if you are staying on a $80+ plan that doesn't include a phone subsidization, you are doing it wrong.

You can always leave for a BYOD plan or negotiate one from you provider via retention. And if you don't like what you hear, you can always leave.

[killramos]

The math on the full price subsidy plans definitely doesn’t work out.

Be then again, most people can’t afford to pay up front for the 1000 dollar phones we all carry around and treat like a pack of gum.

When I did the math on an entry level Rogers plan vs my Apega business plan I could buy a new phone every year and still come out well on top. But the normal price plans are ridiculously uncompetitive.

[ExtraSlow]

Even the regular price BYOD plans are insane. If you love bartering with the retentions staff you can get a good deal from the big guys. That shit drives me nuts.

[revelations]

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Even the regular price BYOD plans are insane. If you love bartering with the retentions staff you can get a good deal from the big guys. That shit drives me nuts.

I stopped playing that game. I was on Rogers for 13 years and on a Ret. pan for 3. They suddenly discontinued all Ret. plans and jacked me up to 120/mo (from about 40$). I couldnt leave fast enough and took an afternoon off (contracting) work to sort it all out.

[jacky4566]

I don't think they are too terribly bad.
Friend of mine renewed his family Rogers contract. Only minimal bartering with retentions.
$200 /month with 12GB shared over 3 lines plus 2 new iPhone 8 with $200 upfront

Public Mobile still has the best (non-special) BYOD pricing. $40/month for 3GB, sounds good to me!

So comparing the two, the friend is paying $27 more per person per month. Plus the $200 upfront. So the total extra cost of the device is $848. If a new device is $818 this sounds like a good loan to me.

At least that's how i view it.
Personally im still on the old Public Mobile $35/month w/ 3GB.

[syscal]

The issue here is that when your 2 year tab is up, they continue taking the subsidy payments. You have to remember to call them and ask to have your plan changed.

Maybe not a big deal on a single personal phone, but I hate the fact we have to track and set reminders to call Rogers every time a phone goes past the two year mark.

I agree with the article, I think it's the telco's just getting away with ripping people off on a technicality. It's no skin off their ass to automatically remove the subsidy at the end of the two years, but they don't because they rely on people not knowing or remembering.

[jacky4566]

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The issue here is that when your 2 year tab is up, they continue taking the subsidy payments. You have to remember to call them and ask to have your plan changed.

Maybe not a big deal on a single personal phone, but I hate the fact we have to track and set reminders to call Rogers every time a phone goes past the two year mark.

I agree with the article, I think it's the telco's just getting away with ripping people off on a technicality. It's no skin off their ass to automatically remove the subsidy at the end of the two years, but they don't because they rely on people not knowing or remembering.

True, Agreed there. It should be treated more like what it is. A loan. If the principal is paid off your plan should drop.

[Misterman]

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The math on the full price subsidy plans definitely doesn’t work out.

Be then again, most people can’t afford to pay up front for the 1000 dollar phones we all carry around and treat like a pack of gum.

When I did the math on an entry level Rogers plan vs my Apega business plan I could buy a new phone every year and still come out well on top. But the normal price plans are ridiculously uncompetitive.

What doesn't work out about the math? So I pay 15$/month for 2 years(360$) in device credit, and I get a 1000$ phone for 300-400$ upfront. Total cost of phone works out to 660-760$, plus I sell it for 300$ after 2 years essentially making my device payments moot. Every 2 years I basically pay 350$ for a brand new 1000$ phone.

Now if I stupidly keep a 2 year old phone when device balance is covered, and don't upgrade to a new phone, then I'm screwing myself by continuing to pay the device balance payments when I don't have a new device.

[killramos]

Hint. The prices are inflated by a lot more than 15 dollars.

[Misterman]

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Hint. The prices are inflated by a lot more than 15 dollars.

Ok so we are getting fucked by the service providers in general. No surprise there, something we all knew. But it's what we have and there isn't any other options. So I'm confused about how the math of subsidy payments vs buying a device outright, doesn't add up? It definitely does not add up, it is wildly inefficient use of money to purchase a device outright.

[killramos]

Because you can get equivalent services elsewhere than the big 3’s normal consumer “share everything” type plans, regardless of subsidization, for substantially less money.

Your “tab” or whatever you want to call it is just different shades of ripoff, and just a way to get you to buy devices you can’t afford more often and it all gets rolled up into an exhorbitant total monthly cost.

When you can get equivalent plans for 50 bucks a month or less. Their basic plans are easily 50 dollars a month overpriced. That’s where you are really getting fucked, the 15 dollars a month is a meaningless pittance in addition to subsidization that’s already built into the business model. That’s how they can afford to keep giving you new phones and locked into the perpetual hamster wheel. Because in people’s kinds 50 bucks a month extra built into the overpriced plan, is easier to swallow than 1000 bucks up front for the phone.

If people could just figure that out, and buy phones they can actually afford, the system would correct itself. But people treat their thousand dollar phones as disposable as a pack of gum so the cycle continues.

And I don’t blame the big 3 for it like most, if you couldn’t tell, I blame people who always want to buy things they can’t afford and would rather play games like perpetual monthly payments and relying on selling phones after on the used market to make the numbers go around. It’s kindof messed up to consider your cellphone to have equity value that you are relying on capturing to make things add up.

[Misterman]

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Because you can get equivalent services elsewhere than the big 3’s normal consumer “share everything” type plans, regardless of subsidization, for substantially less money.

Your “tab” or whatever you want to call it is just different shades of ripoff, and just a way to get you to buy devices you can’t afford more often and it all gets rolled up into an exhorbitant total monthly cost.

When you can get equivalent plans for 50 bucks a month or less. Their basic plans are easily 50 dollars a month overpriced. That’s where you are really getting fucked, the 15 dollars a month is a meaningless pittance in addition to subsidization that’s already built into the business model. That’s how they can afford to keep giving you new phones and locked into the perpetual hamster wheel. Because in people’s kinds 50 bucks a month extra built into the overpriced plan, is easier to swallow than 1000 bucks up front for the phone.

If people could just figure that out, and buy phones they can actually afford, the system would correct itself. But people treat their thousand dollar phones as disposable as a pack of gum so the cycle continues.

And I don’t blame the big 3 for it like most, if you couldn’t tell, I blame people who always want to buy things they can’t afford and would rather play games like perpetual monthly payments and relying on selling phones after on the used market to make the numbers go around. It’s kindof messed up to consider your cellphone to have equity value that you are relying on capturing to make things add up.

Oh so you guys are talking about it being a ripoff due to the availability of something like Wynd mobile and it's 40$ a month everything included and unlimited plans? Yeah fair enough. Those small tier service providers are known for having pretty crummy reception at peak hours, so I guess the question is what is the value on the usability of the service you pay for. But with free wifi available almost every where nowadays, I'm not sure the poor service matters much.

[Sugarphreak]

...

[ZenOps]

Yup, if you have the staying power to stick to one device for more than two years - buying outright is doable, maybe even preferable.

But most people seriously want to upgrade at the end of two years.

[rx7boi]

I prefer BYOD plans since I typically find them cheaper but damn, I hate looking for used devices so now I just get them off Beyonders who are more trustworthy than ghetto single moms slinging BNIB phones.

[lasimmon]

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Oh so you guys are talking about it being a ripoff due to the availability of something like Wynd mobile and it's 40$ a month everything included and unlimited plans? Yeah fair enough. Those small tier service providers are known for having pretty crummy reception at peak hours, so I guess the question is what is the value on the usability of the service you pay for. But with free wifi available almost every where nowadays, I'm not sure the poor service matters much.

Can't speak for wind but not been my experience with any of the other small guys.

[nismodrifter]

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For Cellphones, if you are at or over your 2-years, and you don't want a new device, LEAVE your current provider and come to public mobile. More details in the cellphone plans thread.

Interesting. Will look into this. Thanks.

[ZenOps]

What buying outright gets you is negotiation power. Assuming that someday we will all be on 1.4 gbps 5G networks, I can imagine people will get 100 GB/month on cellular plans as a norm - if they continue the idea of monthly caps.