Tesla vehicle discussion. No Elon or stock chat.

[benyl]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm thinking of pulling the trigger on an S. Might go as far back as 2020 to current if I find a used one that looks attractive, mostly because the wait is so long.

For folks who keep up with the incremental changes and sneaky deletions, are there certain model years or features that are better than others? Any "must haves"? Like better battery tech, better processor, etc? I definitely want the latest and greatest self-driving capability and range.

For Model S, you will want to make sure it is new enough to have MCU2. So anything built after April 2018.

Most of the changes are listed here:

https://tesla-info.com/blog/tesla-model-history.php

[googe]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

For Model S, you will want to make sure it is new enough to have MCU2. So anything built after April 2018.

Most of the changes are listed here:

https://tesla-info.com/blog/tesla-model-history.php

Interesting. Seems like a pain to keep track of all that and verify that the car you want has the right things.

I thought I decided to get an older long range model, but then used inventory had a current model Plaid with 10k on it available that didn't require waiting 6 months, so I just impulse bought that. At least I don't have to wait half a year to find out that the door paint doesn't match I suppose. I knew I would regret spending so much on a car, so I ordered it really quickly before common sense set in.

[benyl]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Interesting. Seems like a pain to keep track of all that and verify that the car you want has the right things.

I thought I decided to get an older long range model, but then used inventory had a current model Plaid with 10k on it available that didn't require waiting 6 months, so I just impulse bought that. At least I don't have to wait half a year to find out that the door paint doesn't match I suppose. I knew I would regret spending so much on a car, so I ordered it really quickly before common sense set in.

baller.

[eglove]

I wish I could afford a plaid on a whim.

/pleb m3 non performance owner

[LilDrunkenSmurf]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I wish I could afford a plaid on a whim.

/pleb m3 non performance owner

I figure it has to be Amazon or Valve money or something similar if he's based out of Seattle.

[googe]

It's just that I keep nodding off at the wheel, so this is basically life insurance

Seriously I might just rip around in it for a few months, realize there is no point to having 1000HP, and downgrade to the much more reasonable non-perf S or a 3 The resale holds up pretty well these days because of lack of inventory.

Also, girlfriend just blew her engine and has no way of getting to work, I don't want to give her money, so my brilliant idea was to buy myself a car I wanted anyway, and let her borrow my other one.

[rage2]

Just curious, but you do realize that most manufacturers have the exact same nodding off at the wheel protection right? Doesn’t detect hands, auto slow down then stop, then throw on hazards. Then there’s the eye detection with a big alarm that goes off to warn you that you need to take a break when it detects when you’re about to fall asleep.

I’m genuinely curious because some of the new Tesla owners thought this shit only exists with Tesla, but I didn’t think you were one of them lol.

[benyl]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Just curious, but you do realize that most manufacturers have the exact same nodding off at the wheel protection right? Doesn’t detect hands, auto slow down then stop, then throw on hazards. Then there’s the eye detection with a big alarm that goes off to warn you that you need to take a break when it detects when you’re about to fall asleep.

I’m genuinely curious because some of the new Tesla owners thought this shit only exists with Tesla, but I didn’t think you were one of them lol.

Some? Fucking all of them think TACC is the biggest and best thing. Like no other car has it. I fucking hate the average Tesla owner. It truly is like they have never owned a car before.

[Darkane]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Just curious, but you do realize that most manufacturers have the exact same nodding off at the wheel protection right? Doesn’t detect hands, auto slow down then stop, then throw on hazards. Then there’s the eye detection with a big alarm that goes off to warn you that you need to take a break when it detects when you’re about to fall asleep.

I’m genuinely curious because some of the new Tesla owners thought this shit only exists with Tesla, but I didn’t think you were one of them lol.

True story. Even a 45k Bolt has the abilities - lifted right from Cadillac.

[googe]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Just curious, but you do realize that most manufacturers have the exact same nodding off at the wheel protection right? Doesn’t detect hands, auto slow down then stop, then throw on hazards. Then there’s the eye detection with a big alarm that goes off to warn you that you need to take a break when it detects when you’re about to fall asleep.

I’m genuinely curious because some of the new Tesla owners thought this shit only exists with Tesla, but I didn’t think you were one of them lol.

Haha, I think you misunderstood me. It's not that I want the Tesla to stop me from nodding off, it's that I want to nap and let it drive me home. So, hopefully the nodding off protection is terrible and I can just paint my eyelids. Also, I was joking.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Some? Fucking all of them think TACC is the biggest and best thing. Like no other car has it. I fucking hate the average Tesla owner. It truly is like they have never owned a car before.

So you're talking about different things, right? rage2 was talking about the nodding off protection, you are talking about the "autopilot" tech in general? Are you also saying that the latest "FSD" (beta) is no better than what other manufacturers have?

[benyl]

FSD is better, but only a few people have the beta. Have to drive like a granny to qualify.

It’s still vapourware if you are expecting to sleep.

A local has the beta and said he had to stop it from crashing into other cars many time while using FSD. It’s good, but not take your eyes off the road good. Plenty of YouTube vids to watch if you are curious.

[heavyD]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I’m genuinely curious because some of the new Tesla owners thought this shit only exists with Tesla, but I didn’t think you were one of them lol.

It's hilarious when you hear Tesla fanboys going on and on about how far Tesla is ahead of legacy automakers when the reality is that they simply aren't paying attention to what other automakers are doing today. Mercedes actually attained level 3 autonomous driving before Tesla lol.

[benyl]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

It's hilarious when you hear Tesla fanboys going on and on about how far Tesla is ahead of legacy automakers when the reality is that they simply aren't paying attention to what other automakers are doing today. Mercedes actually attained level 3 autonomous driving before Tesla lol.

It's because most of them are coming from Fords or Hyundais. There is a large population of owners that have bought the car for the perceived savings and are mesmerized by the tech that you couldn't get until recently (Blue cruise is relatively new).

[killramos]

Being a Tesla fanboy has a requisite level of cognitive dissonance.

[googe]

As far as I can tell, even without FSD Beta, Tesla are still quite a bit better at nearly everything except waking up the driver. What automaker has a car that people can buy with better autonomous tech, and what car is it on?

And Mercedes has not released Level 3 (and Level 3 doesn't necessarily mean better than Level 2). We are mocking people for liking Tesla's tech because there is a prototype on another car that nobody can actually buy and might be better at some things? Speaking of cognitive dissonance, you all realize this is dumber than being a fanboy, right?

BlueCruise is shit and only on the 2021 F-150 and 2021 Mach-E. And it's still vaporware. Owners of the car are promised a future update. Can't do the TransCanada in BC, only prequalified highways that have been mapped.

How does BlueCruise differ from other competitors?
BlueCruise differs from other competitors by offering a true hands-free driving experience on pre-qualified sections of road called BlueZones. BlueCruise also uses text and blue lighting cues to communicate that the feature is in hands-free mode. These cues are effective even for drivers with color blindness.

How do I check Hands-Free BlueZone coverage in my area prior to purchasing?
Hands-Free BlueZones are available on over 130,000 miles of highways across North America. An interactive coverage map is coming soon.

So Ford is out.

SuperCruise is shit. If you have a 2020 to 2022 model year car that has it, you only get these roads:


That's competitive tech? I'm sure it works GREAT on the segment of the only route you can even activate it on. But it's not even better on the routes that it does work on, other than you can take your hands off the wheel for extended periods of time...at the cost of a camera tracking your eyeballs.

So, GM is out, at least for me. Nobody wants a CT6 or an Escalade anyway.

Honda...well, they claim Level 3 tech on a Japan model. In North America, it has Adaptive Cruise + Lane Keeping. That's...not impressive.

Mercedes has a 2022 S-class model with Drive Pilot...in Germany. So, nothing. Just ACC+Lane Keeping on some NA models still. It is nice that it can follow cars if lane markings aren't visible. This sounds like the closest thing to non-FSD Tesla, but not better.

Tesla doesn't have "mapped roads", the non-beta tech works from onramp to offramp and has for years. And every car they have gets it. This is still a pretty massive difference.

And most "lane keep assist" systems I've seen are really bad and can't be relied on. Like it gently nudges you back and forth into the lane. Only a few vehicles seem to do actual active lane centering.

Please, talk tech and try to set aside any hard-on or hate-on for Elon. Is all the hate a result of Tesla fans who think literally nothing else exists on other cars? Because objectively speaking I still don't see a worthy autonomous driving competitor that I can order right now. If there is a better system on a car that I can buy, please tell me, because I will buy it.

[rage2]

I'm assuming you're talking about highway driving and not driving through city streets with lights and what not? Highway driving is easy, and a surprising # of cars can sorta do it. I installed a defeat device in my E coupe and it drove itself from Calgary to Edmonton without any intervention. Watched the whole thing, set cruise to 120 and it just did its thing all the way. Steep turns in the way? It'll even slow down based on the map (slows down based on drive modes too, so it'll be more aggressive in sport). Even in city streets, my car was able to drive on it's own quite well. It won't stop for lights, but it'll gladly follow the idiot ahead. The video has me touching the wheel because I didn't have a defeat device on it.



I've driven the BMW and Audi ones, and yea, they're roughly the same sort of performance. It's really just auto steer/lane keep and traffic aware cruise control. Now if you're talking about city street and normal driving, even Tesla doesn't have traffic light, lane selection, turns 100% yet, sleeping would be a bit of a death wish today. Just ride a waymo or something.

Edit - just wanted to add, our Toyota Sienna has this same thing as well. It's a bit limited though, it can't turn more than X degrees of steering angle, so it can almost make it to edmonton. 3 or 4 turns are too steep for it's limit. It also sucks as pure self driving because it's clearly not designed for it and expects hand on wheels at all times. It doesn't warn you when it disengages and will happily run off the road lol.

[googe]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm assuming you're talking about highway driving and not driving through city streets with lights and what not? Highway driving is easy, and a surprising # of cars can sorta do it. I installed a defeat device in my E coupe and it drove itself from Calgary to Edmonton without any intervention. Watched the whole thing, set cruise to 120 and it just did its thing all the way. Even in city streets, my car was able to drive on it's own quite well. It won't stop for lights, but it'll gladly follow the idiot ahead. The video has me touching the wheel because I didn't have a defeat device on it.



I've driven the BMW and Audi ones, and yea, they're roughly the same sort of performance. It's really just auto steer/lane keep and distance aware cruise control. Now if you're talking about city street and normal driving, even Tesla doesn't have traffic light, lane selection, turns 100% yet, sleeping would be a bit of a death wish today. Just ride a waymo or something.

Haha I need to reiterate that having a nap was a joke. I don't see anyone doing that for 10+ years, for both technical and regulatory reasons, outside of very limited service areas.

But yeah, I'm completely discounting city street driving (although not city driving where onramps/offramps are involved), the Tesla beta is too unreliable to give them points for that yet.

But "Navigate on Autopilot" seems like a huge step up from ACC+LKA+Follow, even without support for stop signs/lights, although the practical difference in most cases might be small. Still, it's absolutely not worse than any other offering by any reasonable measure, as far as I can tell. So anyone claiming that other automakers are "ahead" of Tesla don't seem to be making sense.


And I have no illusions of it being magical. I've worked in tech long enough to know there's always an edge case your devs didn't think of. There's going to be weird shit like this for a very long time I think. The long tail is long.

[ThePenIsMightier]

The long tail is long is a very apt description.

[rage2]

OK I thought your napping this was legit. I'm like WTF happened to you man haha.

There's still some underlying problems with just base autopilot. Phantom braking is probably the big one, there's enough Teslas in Calgary where I've seen it happen both in front and behind me. Pedestrian bridges on Crowchild around Dalhousie seems to be a trouble spot for them. Not sure how bad it is in Calgary, but in some states it's so bad that people drive manually because there's no basic cruise control at all. I mean it's all subjective, where you live, and your appetite for risk. Some parts of Tesla autopilot are better, some are worse than the rest of the solutions out there.

Navigate on autopilot, let me know how your experience is. My experience was pretty rough, Cali random slow traffic, car would slow down with the slow traffic then decide to change lanes, only to stay slow as fuck (this is a P100D I'm in) then slowly accelerate up to speed. Then it blocks the lane going speed limit, and you know Cali, you need to be doing +25 in the left haha. The lane selection feels really random and made zero sense. The braking was abrupt as hell, but that's because it doesn't see far enough ahead I think? It's basically a useless gimmick to me, I can navigate the lanes 100x better and I don't even know the roads well down there. It feels like NOA, FSD, all this stuff is just layers on top of the base TACC, LKA, LCA tech, which isn't robust enough yet to support it.

[benyl]

I am comfortable with my cognitive dissonance. lol.

I know what a Tesla is and isn't. There a many out there that don't.

I like the cars and how easy they make my life. Never have to go to a grubby gas station. No trips to the dealer for oil changes.

The funny thing about many Tesla owners is that they don't believe they are beta testers.