Pilot shortage? Is this real?

[Maxx Mazda]

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How many hours do pilots typically spend flying vs hours paid? In construction, 2000 hrs experience/yr isn’t too difficult to reach.

Well, we’re governed by flight time and duty regulations so legally you can’t work more than 1000 hours in a year, but the only time I ever maxed out was when I was doing medevac. Like most careers, the further you progress the better life becomes, so right now I’m working about 12-14 days a month, and depending on what I bid I’m only away from home maybe 10 nights a month. A typical month will have you work 75 credit hours, but that doesn’t mean you’re flying 75 hours in a month.

Another big problem with the industry is that it’s not a recognized profession in Canada. Seniority is king here. So, there was recently a guy who started here with about 12,000 hours just on the Boeing 777 alone. Was a training captain for Emirates. Now, he’s seniority number last because he just started, and even though he’s got more experience than me, I’ll be his captain one day just by virtue of seniority. How fucked up is that? If we were a recognized profession, we could port our experience to another company and be slotted in accordingly. Unfortunately the unions are all built on a solid foundation of seniority being first and foremost, so that’ll never happen.

The job itself is incredibly easy, and this is probably one of the most rewarding careers I can imagine. It’s super sweet to be able to be paid to travel the world and have tons of time off, I love what I do. The job is great, the industry is fucked.

[Xtrema]

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Job is great, the industry is fucked.

So in one hand, experience pilots get all the good jobs while noobs gotta starve for 5-6 years before you get a good paying gig.

But once you get a good paying gig, you have to deal with stupid seniority of an union system.

All the while the low cost regionals are not unionized, pay is shit and passenger safety is endangered.


Damn, this industry is fucked.

[Tik-Tok]

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Damn, this industry is fucked.

And that's just the pilot side. The whole industry is heading to a tipping point which IMO will either cause ticket prices to skyrocket, or will cheapen them but at the same time destroy the Canadian aviation industry.

[Maxx Mazda]

The regionals are all unionized too.

Honestly, I blame the travelling public and the airlines equally. The public wants more for less, and they’ll cry foul over airlines charging $600 for a ticket to Toronto. This is why LCC’s like Flair, sunwing, and that pink abortion Swoop exist. They all drive the industry down lower and lower, and the passengers still want it cheaper. I swear, people would willingly get on an airplane with a less experienced crew if it meant they could save $15. People will jump on the MAX when it’s back, mark my words, because they want what’s cheapest. That’s all. It’s insane how far people will go to save a minuscule amount of money. I’ve seen it. I actually had one passenger accuse me of “making too much money” and that was the reason her ticket was so expensive. Can you believe that? I’ve been flying for 19 years now and I’ve never seen the industry this bad. It’s gonna get worse before it gets better too. It’s going to take a Colgan-esque accident in Canada to make changes. It’s the sad truth, but look at the MAX debacle. Nobody does anything until people die.

[revelations]

^ the number of fume events also is a great example of the industry and regulation doing fuck all to protect the pax and crew. Neurotoxins (TCP, from mobil jet II) being released into a pressure vessel with hundreds of people on board on a regular basis all over the world. Technology and systems exist right now, to clean up the air coming into the cabin from the compressors, but no one is mandating anything.

People have died as a direct result of this, but because it does not garner the media attention like a crash, it wont be dealt with until both flight deck crew are incapacitated and a ship full of passengers is lost - we have come close to a hull loss because of this, where both crew landed but had no recollection of how. Happend a few years ago in the EU if memory serves.

Neither Airbus or Boeing have done anything about this - save for the 787 with its bleed-less engines. The A320 series is particularly notorious for this.

http://avherald.com/h?article=4d1307e4&opt=0

[jutes]

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Becoming a Pilot is very expensive. I have two friends that are pilots and both of them went to the MRU program for commercial pilot, 2 year diploma with flight time and it was 80-100k because of all of the flight hours. Also, just getting your license is expensive, probably 15-20k.

And then you come out of school with a ton of debt and have a tough time finding a job. However, sounds like all of the pilots are retiring so there is a shortage.

Could always do the military route, get your hours and training paid for then jump ship. Not exactly that simple but sure beats going into debt and not having a job after.

[ercchry]

:opens beyond while waiting to board a tiny wj plane:

Thanks Tik-Tok!

[Maxx Mazda]

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Neither Airbus or Boeing have done anything about this - save for the 787 with its bleed-less engines. The A320 series is particularly notorious for this.

I fly the 320 series and have read all about aerotoxic syndrome. Nasty stuff. Haven’t witnessed the dirty sock smell myself, but if I ever do I plan to get my mask on ASAP. I’m not taking any chances.

Edit: are the IAE engines more prone to this happening than the CFM’s? In the link you posted it was Lufty and I believe they’re an entirely IAE fleet.

[revelations]

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I fly the 320 series and have read all about aerotoxic syndrome. Nasty stuff. Haven’t witnessed the dirty sock smell myself, but if I ever do I plan to get my mask on ASAP. I’m not taking any chances.

Edit: are the IAE engines more prone to this happening than the CFM’s? In the link you posted it was Lufty and I believe they’re an entirely IAE fleet.

No, the reports are coming in from all over the globe, but LH has a very open reporting culture and strong unions for the crew. Chances are they are reporting incidents whereas other carriers are not as much. I have not read CADORS about this much either but Canada has a decent reporting culture as well (my impression).

Apparently many of these fume events for LH are caused by the APU not being shutdown properly and thus being over-serviced with oil - not so much to do with leaking engine frontal bearing, oil seals - but some of the newer engines are also prone to this as well (PW geared fan).

EDIT

Another recent miss where BOTH flight crew were close to being out due to fumes.

http://avherald.com/h?article=4cfb5c82&opt=0

[Rat Fink]

.

[msommers]

A family friend of ours does Trans Pacific flights and makes really good money, but he's been flying for decades. Pilots lives are hard, commonly away from family, the constant change in altitude is supposed to have some life-shortening effects, you're lonely often and apparently alcoholism is quite common.

Just need another world war to get more pilots again, right?!

[Tik-Tok]

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Apparently many of these fume events for LH are caused by the APU not being shutdown properly and thus being over-serviced with oil - not so much to do with leaking engine frontal bearing, oil seals - but some of the newer engines are also prone to this as well (PW geared fan).

Every company I've ever worked for has a "don't fill it to full" policy, because we all know it just pukes the oil out (internally or externally). Yet maintenance manuals still state otherwise. So if a company is doing it 100% by the book, there's going to be issues. Especially if you have someone trying to service it while it's still hot.

[Maxx Mazda]

How did they shut the APU down improperly? On the airbus, it automatically continues to run for 2 minutes when selected off of the APU bleed was used. If just the Gen was used it unloads the APU and shuts down.

[tcon]

Don't worry guys, the TFW program will start filling those positions...

[AndyL]

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Don't worry guys, the TFW program will start filling those positions...

Why do you think half the world comes here for flight training?? Well that and you're less likely to get shot than in USA...

[Tik-Tok]

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Don't worry guys, the TFW program will start filling those positions...

No, but I'm sure our feds will allow an open skies agreement once it gets bad enough. Cheaper tickets for consumers, and only fuck over one industry that they don't give a rats ass about anyways.

[revelations]

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How did they shut the APU down improperly? On the airbus, it automatically continues to run for 2 minutes when selected off of the APU bleed was used. If just the Gen was used it unloads the APU and shuts down.

From what I gather, 'the book is wrong' on how to do it - thats what other flight crew have stated at least.

[Rat Fink]

.

[revelations]

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Maxx,

Have you heard if anyone has applied to ACs new entry program where you pay $126,000 bucks and go from a nobody off the street to FO in a CRJ?

Thats probably still less than what MRU, etc. is charging for a 4 year program, that maybe gets you working in the bush.

[Maxx Mazda]

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Maxx,

Have you heard if anyone has applied to ACs new entry program where you pay $126,000 bucks and go from a nobody off the street to FO in a CRJ?

That's not Air Canada, that's Jazz. Yes, I've heard of it, and we all hate it. The kicker is that those kids who do sign up, are going to stunt their career progression down the road bigtime, where they won't be eligible for their ATPL since they have no pilot-in-command time, and they'll end up being a CRJ FO for their entire career, unless they quit and go fly some multi turbines up north for awhile, thus negating them even going to Jazz in the first place. It's a win for Jazz, because they get a pilot who's now basically unable to go anywhere else for over a decade. They've guaranteed themselves a supply of first officers.