Alberta public sector wages: 0% increase.

[The Cosworth]

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Most people: "I can't wait to take a couple of weeks off from teh grind in the summer."

Teachers: "I get three months off. BUT I HAVE TO TAKE IT ALL IN THE SUMMER!!"

sigh.

LOL 3 months in the summer now?

July, Julugust, and August?

[Mitsu3000gt]

It's not 3 months, but let's see:

July/August (40 work days)
Christmas (approx. 10 days)
Spring/Easter break (approx. 5 days)

Not sure how many PD/convention days there are.

That's 11 weeks of work days, so the above estimate of ~2.5 months (non- discretionary) looks to be pretty accurate.

[Buster]

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LOL 3 months in the summer now?

July, Julugust, and August?

pick a number. doesnt matter.

[The Cosworth]

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It's not 3 months, but let's see:

July/August (40 work days)
Christmas (approx. 10 days)
Spring/Easter break (approx. 5 days)

Not sure how many PD/convention days there are.

That's 11 weeks of work days, so the above estimate of 2.5 months (non- discretionary) looks to be pretty accurate.

I broke out down earlier (if that's what you were referring to). Every school board has a calendar. You can view Rockyview's here

It gives days the teachers work but students are off, the days teachers are in convention, the days teachers go back to school in August. Etc. Etc.

Note, Admin don't follow these breaks, this is just teaching staff.

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All my friends with kids, at least someone in their family is sick pretty well 100% of the time throughout the year. The younger kids seem to have a never ending runny nose as well. Teachers probably build up pretty good immune systems but that's a lot of chances to get sick haha.

I was sick for almost 2 years straight when she started teaching. Then about a year straight when we had my daughter. Nothing luckily with my second or with her since. Yeah the sickness' can really go around fast and it can be pretty brutal. Plus a lot of parents send their kids to school sick if "they're not that bad" because those parents can't afford the time off or have a caregiver to leave them with, this making the cycle continue.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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I broke out down earlier (if that's what you were referring to). Every school board has a calendar. You can view Rockyview's here

It gives days the teachers work but students are off, the days teachers are in convention, the days teachers go back to school in August. Etc. Etc.

Note, Admin don't follow these breaks, this is just teaching staff.

Right, you did sorry.

Convention days aren't mandatory to my knowledge (most of the teachers I know don't seem to ever go). The few that do go seem to get drunk and party a lot haha.

[Buster]

Teachers have 180 instruction days per year.

There are about 252 working days per year.

So they have 72 days where they aren't instructing. That's 14.4 weeks of non-instruction days. They have no more than 20 additional days for PD and whatever...but there's some debate about whether those should actually be "working days" depending on your point of view. Even if you count them, then teachers get over 50 days (10 weeks) of paid non working time.

It's unfortunate that it's in teh summer when no one ever wants time off or anything.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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It's unfortunate that it's in teh summer when no one ever wants time off or anything.

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or not, but a lot of people don't want their time off in the summer. The most popular travel destinations in July/August are usually really expensive, really crowded, and really hot. Personally I never travel in the summer because it's the best weather we get in Calgary and I want to be here for it haha. I want to be gone when the weather sucks, prices aren't 2-3X worse and I don't spend my whole holiday waiting in lineups (dramatic, but you get the point). If you have kids, you are pretty well limited to summer/Christmas/spring break travel anyway though as it mirrors the teacher schedule.

Perhaps a more interesting question would be how many people would, at their current job whatever it may be, trade 4-5 weeks of discretionary holiday for ~10 weeks of designated holiday. I personally wouldn't do it but I'm sure it would work well for some others.

[Buster]

You are suggesting that people would rather work through most of the only 3 nice months we get in Calgary? They would rather have the winter shitty months off because taht's when it's cheap to go to mexico so they can have time off to go somewhere warm?

And you're asking me if I'm being serious?

[msommers]

I volunteered for a couple years at an elementary school, helping kids out with their science homework for a few hours a week. I liked it but I think I liked it because of the short hours. Every time I walked out of there I was smiling but I'm not gonna lie, also mentally very tired from trying to wrangle the very few kids I mentored. How teachers do it day in, day out...my hats off to them.

[AndyL]

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I volunteered for a couple years at an elementary school, helping kids out with their science homework for a few hours a week. I liked it but I think I liked it because of the short hours. Every time I walked out of there I was smiling but I'm not gonna lie, also mentally very tired from trying to wrangle the very few kids I mentored. How teachers do it day in, day out...my hats off to them.

Alcohol... The answer is alcohol. Wine on weeknights, tekillya on weekends

[The Cosworth]

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Teachers have 180 instruction days per year.

There are about 252 working days per year.

So they have 72 days where they aren't instructing. That's 14.4 weeks of non-instruction days. They have no more than 20 additional days for PD and whatever...but there's some debate about whether those should actually be "working days" depending on your point of view. Even if you count them, then teachers get over 50 days (10 weeks) of paid non working time.

It's unfortunate that it's in teh summer when no one ever wants time off or anything.

Potatoe potato? I said they get 11 weeks off a year so that shouldn't be a shock. Lets add up and compare a teacher to a normal salaried employee. So someone did the math earlier for me and said that my wife will work 43.5 hours this week week (+5 hours non-lunch that was removed). So 48.5 hours. Round up to 50 to be fair for flex, report cards, easy math, etc? So if a normal 5 day week, to get 50 hours a week, they are 'working' average 10 hour days.

Normal salaried employee (1965 hours a year)

For a teacher I counted 12 PL, org, and convention days. Then you have to add in the 6 stats.

If you work 1965 hours a year (typical salaried employee as we said earlier) that works out to 196.5 days of work a teacher must do at the 10 hours. If there are 252 working days a year as you say (didn't check, don't doubt you though), take off the 61 days (11 weeks vacation (and at least 4 of these are stats don't forget (Canada Day, Xmas, etc) but we can ignore that and the 6 stats) that equals 191 days.

So really, in the end what we're saying is teachers get 1 extra week off the whole year? 191 working days vs 196.5 working days? Also, I think the 1965 calculation doesn't include vacation as 1965 / 252 is 7.8 hour days. I bet you talk to a payroll person and they tell you it is some stat thing. So now, average person gets what, 3 weeks vacation? So 15 days? So therefore the average person should work 180.5 days. So the teacher on average puts in 11.5 days MORE now?

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Right, you did sorry.

Convention days aren't mandatory to my knowledge (most of the teachers I know don't seem to ever go). The few that do go seem to get drunk and party a lot haha.

They're mandatory for license and the schoolboard is paying for them. Now whether they're enforced is another thing. I know those teachers who got caught on the news drinking at James Joyce didn't look like they went to convention.

[Buster]

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Potatoe potato? I said they get 11 weeks off a year so that shouldn't be a shock. Lets add up and compare a teacher to a normal salaried employee. So someone did the math earlier for me and said that my wife will work 43.5 hours this week week (+5 hours non-lunch that was removed). So 48.5 hours. Round up to 50 to be fair for flex, report cards, easy math, etc? So if a normal 5 day week, to get 50 hours a week, they are 'working' average 10 hour days.

Normal salaried employee (1965 hours a year)

For a teacher I counted 12 PL, org, and convention days. Then you have to add in the 6 stats.

If you work 1965 hours a year (typical salaried employee as we said earlier) that works out to 196.5 days of work a teacher must do at the 10 hours. If there are 252 working days a year as you say (didn't check, don't doubt you though), take off the 61 days (11 weeks vacation and the 6 stats) that equals 191 days. So really, in the end what we're saying is teachers get 1 extra week off the whole year? 191 working days vs 196.5 working days? Also, I think the 1965 calculation doesn't include vacation as 1965 / 252 is 7.8 hour days. I bet you talk to a payroll person and they tell you it is some stat thing. So now, average person gets what, 3 weeks vacation? So 15 days? So therefore the average person should work 180.5 days. So the teacher on average puts in 11.5 days MORE now?



They're mandatory for license and the schoolboard is paying for them. Now whether they're enforced is another thing. I know those teachers who got caught on the news drinking at James Joyce didn't look like they went to convention.

I hope you don't run into a life and death situation that involves math.

[The Cosworth]

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I hope you don't run into a life and death situation that involves math.

Can't tell if you're telling me I'm wrong but I do math for a living and so far my financials and regulatory calculations haven't had too many errors in the last 12 years. But yeah it is possible my armchair discussion with you is incorrect. LOL

[Buster]

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Can't tell if you're telling me I'm wrong but I do math for a living and so far my financials and regulatory calculations haven't had too many errors in the last 12 years. But yeah it is possible my armchair discussion with you is incorrect. LOL

how do the regulators feel about apples to oranges comparisons and "rounding up"?

[The Cosworth]

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how do the regulators feel about apples to oranges comparisons and "rounding up"?

Well if we can show why using the average over the year is reasonable they're fine... but I'll do the math from scratch if it makes you feel better. Haha. And I don't know what you mean about the apples and oranges so I can't do that for you.

So....

365 * (5/7) = 260.7143 weekdays a year.

Teacher
6 stats
55 days vacation
Total time off 61 days.
260.7143 - 61 = 199.7143 days.

Normal salaried employee
10 stats (based on 2019 found here: https://www.statutoryholidays.com/2019.php)
15 vacation days
Total time off 25 days.
260.7143 - 25 = 235.7143 days.

Now to accommodate for the hours. Lets go on the safe side and say 9 hour days for the salaried employee (8-5) with a 1 hour lunch break but lets be honest 8-4 is a more normal work-schedule for industry. But that might skew the numbers so lets assume full 8 hour days. For the teacher, lets use the exact number calculated of 48.5 which works out to 9.7 hours.

Teacher
199.7143 days * 9.7 hours = 1937.2287 hours worked a year.

Normal salaried employee
235.7143 days * 8 hours = 1885.7144 hours worked a year.

So the teacher works 51.5143 hours more a year.


Edited: to fix sig-digs.

And to be fair, I find this fun to do. But I am also the guy who builds cities (cities skylines if anyone is wondering) and cars in my spare time because I like the tolerances, math, coding, etc. So yeah I am a nerd about this. Hahah

[Buster]

I can claim my peenar is 12 inches long if I am allowed to also make any number of arbitrary assumptions and adjustments.

[speedog]

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I know there are lots of old-timer jokes in here but this is actually something every industry is struggling with. We have people at my work who've had 20 years with no sick days. People know people get burnt out and sick anyways so the idea of 'coming to work sick' and sticking it out is actually flipping. People would rather sick people not be around. We have quite a few people now who we actually 'send home'. They're more issue having them at work than it is worth.

Thing is, if I was sick then I stayed at home. I also would not go shopping or skiing as well on my sick day. Man, I can not remember the last time I was sick with the flu.

[kobe tai]

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I can claim my peenar is 12 inches long if I am allowed to also make any number of arbitrary assumptions and adjustments.

The whole thread is based on assumptions if you haven't noticed.

[Buster]

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The whole thread is based on assumptions if you haven't noticed.

My comments are not.

[Mitsu3000gt]

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You are suggesting that people would rather work through most of the only 3 nice months we get in Calgary? They would rather have the winter shitty months off because taht's when it's cheap to go to mexico so they can have time off to go somewhere warm?

And you're asking me if I'm being serious?

I'm suggesting some people would rather take vacation from Calgary when it's -30C than when it's +30C and insanely busy/expensive to travel most places, yes. Most people I know vacation this way and stick around during the summer for the very limited amount of time that it's nice in Calgary, so I can't imagine it's very unusual. Also, depending on your line of work, the summer months are quiet. Anyway, I realize that doesn't apply to everyone but that has overwhelmingly been my observation within my circle of friends/coworkers. What I hear the most from people with kids on the topic is complaining about having to only travel in the Summer or Christmas.