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Thread: Novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV/COVID-19)

  1. #7601
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    If you can maintain 2m from anyone that's not in your cohort, you don't need a mask. Otherwise you do.

    Gyms suppose to space people out to keep that enforced.

    As for restaurants, you are suppose to keep a party no larger than 6 and each party must be 2m away from each other OR each party has sufficient physical barrier in lieu of 2m.

    Here's guidance for each sector:
    https://www.alberta.ca/guidance-docu...ector-guidance



    CMOH Order 05-2020 is still in place. That's why I have to answer a questionnaire daily before heading into office. So if I caused an outbreak in office, the company won't be held liable (if I lie on the questionnaire).
    Except that the Calgary bylaw is not saying you don't need a mask if you are 6 feet apart. Just that indoor publics spaces is mandatory *except* in those areas like restaurants, gyms and schools. I just think it is weird that the most vulnerable places you're cool without a mask, but the areas where you probably have the least chance of coming into contact (at least have more control over it) within six feet it is mandatory.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mitsu3000gt View Post
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    I dunno, $300 isn't really that high and your chances of getting caught are essentially zero if you just look at the cars around you first. Plus it's a lot easier to hide what you're doing in a car compared to walking into a store where dozens of people will see you. I've already seen people in yelling matches at Safeway lol.

    It was just a suggestion. Obviously a certain percentage of people will still ignore it but if a consequence is implemented that most people deem to be severe, that is going to be the best reasonable deterrent we have.
    +3 demerits + insurance increases but Idk slippery slope you don't want to be too extreme like Sharia law where you get 6 lashes for drinking beer.

    Calgary seems quite chill but what if you get a mob of ppl protesting the masks? Time to go ticket thousands of ppl?

    Will see how all this plays out. Crazy times indeed.
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  3. #7603
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    Quote Originally Posted by tirebob View Post
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    Except that the Calgary bylaw is not saying you don't need a mask if you are 6 feet apart. Just that indoor publics spaces is mandatory *except* in those areas like restaurants, gyms and schools. I just think it is weird that the most vulnerable places you're cool without a mask, but the areas where you probably have the least chance of coming into contact (at least have more control over it) within six feet it is mandatory.
    Well until those Under Armor performance mask proves to be usable, mandating masks in gyms are a bit much for rigorous workouts. And you can't eat/drink with a mask, so exemption is also obvious. So you have to fall back to social distancing and hopes operators to do the right thing.

    For example, Personal services (salon/massage/barber shop) clients are supposed to wear a mask but people still don't. This bylaw will now give owners/operators to refuse customers without mask. You can't save all sectors.

    School is weird. Sounds like it could be out of the city's jurisdiction but Kenney basically said he let each school board/city to decide.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 07-23-2020 at 03:41 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    Well until those Under Armor performance mask proves to be usable, mandating masks in gyms are a bit much for rigorous workouts. And you can't eat/drink with a mask, so exemption is also obvious. So you have to fall back to social distancing and hopes operators to do the right thing.

    For example, Personal services (salon/massage/barber shop) clients are supposed to wear a mask but people still don't. This bylaw will now give owners/operators to refuse customers without mask. You can't save all sectors.

    School is weird. Sounds like it could be out of the city's jurisdiction but Kenney basically said he let each school board/city to decide.
    That is the issue though - exceptions in some of the highest transmission areas. If they were truly worried, they would close restaurants/gyms/schools again but they aren't, so it seems like mostly safety theater if they are going to make all the highest likelihood transmission areas mask-free, and on top of that, have no real consequence for an infraction.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mitsu3000gt View Post
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    That is the issue though - exceptions in some of the highest transmission areas. If they were truly worried, they would close restaurants/gyms/schools again but they aren't, so it seems like mostly safety theater if they are going to make all the highest likelihood transmission areas mask-free, and on top of that, have no real consequence for an infraction.

    And that's the thing, they are NOT truly worried. The hospital has lots of room, so they're getting people out there again. That's why it is silly having people go full Karen about the mask wearing. Making masks law or mandatory will increase usage rates with the public, but if there is still people that don't comply, it really doesn't matter. People are acting like this is some sort of life and death issue.

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    Have they said masks won't be mandatory for gyms? I haven't read any of the news/finer details.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mitsu3000gt View Post
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    That is the issue though - exceptions in some of the highest transmission areas. If they were truly worried, they would close restaurants/gyms/schools again but they aren't, so it seems like mostly safety theater if they are going to make all the highest likelihood transmission areas mask-free, and on top of that, have no real consequence for an infraction.
    Well, given what's going on in other countries, you may be right that dine-in/bar business may have to shut down again. Doesn't mean we shouldn't give people a chance. And there's is also other changes you can mandate like mask off only until you sit down or get to your station.

    But end of the day, I see some people will pull fake medical cards to avoid wearing mask. The law lacks teeth but at least it hope to make it more common and acceptable so more people will adopt it. And if some one did indeed pick COVID up at restaurants and gyms, they won't spread to malls, ctrains or buses for other to pick it up.

    In IT security term, it's reducing attack surface. For example, take Sunridge mall, restaurant take up about may be 30% of sq footage. Without mask mandate, you could get hit in 100% of the area, now it's reduce to that 30% in theory.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 07-23-2020 at 04:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by 2Legit2Quit View Post
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    Have they said masks won't be mandatory for gyms? I haven't read any of the news/finer details.
    No masks when exercising

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    But end of the day, I see some people will pull fake medical cards to avoid wearing mask.
    I am not sure how we are going to handle this... If someone comes into my business and refuses to wear a mask for medical purposes or whatever, am I supposed to not let them in? Personally I am the least worried of unmasked people but now it is a bylaw, what are we supposed to do? I am not going to police this for the cops by asking for proof etc, but I also don't want bullshit arising from it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tirebob View Post
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    I am not sure how we are going to handle this... If someone comes into my business and refuses to wear a mask for medical purposes or whatever, am I supposed to not let them in? Personally I am the least worried of unmasked people but now it is a bylaw, what are we supposed to do? I am not going to police this for the cops by asking for proof etc, but I also don't want bullshit arising from it.
    For your set up Bob, all you have to do is install a plastic/plexiglass barrier along you desk and bar entry of customers into your garage/washroom.

    Masks also don’t need to be worn if a person is separated from another person by a shield or plastic barrier.
    But you may have to do a bit more cleaning/wipe downs in the waiting area.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 07-23-2020 at 04:15 PM.

  11. #7611
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    For your set up Bob, all you have to do is install a plastic barrier along you desk and bar entry of customers into your garage/washroom.
    Yeah I don't like that route. I hate those things. I find when I am at places with those things I am asking people to repeat themselves constantly and can't hear shit. I also have to always be showing people stuff on the computer and I don't like the idea of having to have people come behind the desk constantly which really would defeat the purpose anyways. I would rather keep things a little more natural and organic feeling if that makes sense. We are also that shop that people like specifically because we are open and don't mind customers hanging out observing us working on their vehicles asking questions etc. It gives people trust and I don't want to lose that.

  12. #7612
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    Bob, when someone walks in, you say one of two things
    1) thanks for wearing a mask
    or
    2) please put on a mask

    and then, your customer does what they want, and you serve them normally.
    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    You realize you are talking to the guy who made his own furniture out of salad bowls right?

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    Alberta ICU up to 21 (from 6 a month or so ago). Hospitalizations up to 106, our highest was 113 on April 30th so we're basically back to where we were when things peaked

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by tirebob View Post
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    Yeah I don't like that route. I hate those things. I find when I am at places with those things I am asking people to repeat themselves constantly and can't hear shit. I also have to always be showing people stuff on the computer and I don't like the idea of having to have people come behind the desk constantly which really would defeat the purpose anyways. I would rather keep things a little more natural and organic feeling if that makes sense. We are also that shop that people like specifically because we are open and don't mind customers hanging out observing us working on their vehicles asking questions etc. It gives people trust and I don't want to lose that.
    Maybe just clear signage, please use a mask to enter, if you'd prefer not to use a mask you can do the check in and checkout via phone with them outside? Not great but it's a option

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    Quote Originally Posted by tirebob View Post
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    I am not sure how we are going to handle this... If someone comes into my business and refuses to wear a mask for medical purposes or whatever, am I supposed to not let them in? Personally I am the least worried of unmasked people but now it is a bylaw, what are we supposed to do? I am not going to police this for the cops by asking for proof etc, but I also don't want bullshit arising from it.
    Put the sign up and do what you want. The only way for a business to be fined is to not display the sign, there isn’t any sort of obligation to refuse service/demand someone put a mask on or call bylaw if someone isn’t wearing one.

    I can see actual enforcement on this being close to zero and just used in egregious cases or if you act like a twat to the PO. No business is going to risk losing business or getting a reputation for snitching by refusing service. I CAN see the “stay home/you’re not an “essential worker” crowd getting a massive hard on about it and trying to shame people on social media though
    See Crank. See Crank Walk. Walk Crank Walk.

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    They are betting that this will create a critical mass of max wearers that put peer pressure on non-mask wearers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FraserB View Post
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    I can see actual enforcement on this being close to zero
    I foresee them aggressively enforcing this for the cashflow.

    What else are all those bylaw officers doing since no one is parking downtown anymore?

  17. #7617
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    Trying to train myself to grab a mask every time I run into a shop, but this is going to take some work. Also people from either side seem to look at you judgingly these last few days....how long before we see some USA karen-style videos from YYC

  18. #7618
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    Quote Originally Posted by tirebob View Post
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    I am not sure how we are going to handle this... If someone comes into my business and refuses to wear a mask for medical purposes or whatever, am I supposed to not let them in? Personally I am the least worried of unmasked people but now it is a bylaw, what are we supposed to do? I am not going to police this for the cops by asking for proof etc, but I also don't want bullshit arising from it.
    Not your job to enforce bylaws. You could ask them to leave if youre uncomfortable or call bylaw or the cops to enforce it but you're not obligated to enforce it yourself.

    Edit. Sounds like you may need to post a sign but you still aren't obligated to enforce
    Last edited by dirtsniffer; 07-23-2020 at 04:55 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tik-Tok View Post
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    I foresee them aggressively enforcing this for the cashflow.

    What else are all those bylaw officers doing since no one is parking downtown anymore?
    Bylaw isn’t CPA and is still busy, there are about 100 bylaw officers for Calgary and that includes animal services. So they either make their current workload lower priority than mask enforcement or it’s not going to really happen. You won’t see them taking cops off patrol to do it either and even the ones that might see it, probably won’t do anything.

    Then you have Nenshi saying that enforcement isn’t the main goal and education is. They might stricter on businesses since it’s easier to enforce on a complaint basis
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    So places like Costco and IKEA. No mask in cafeteria but mask in store? Are cafeterias open?

    Is social distancing still required with a mask?

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