Novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV/COVID-19)

[Xtrema]

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Once again, its bullshit. An incompetent gov and AHS has caused this, not much of anything to do with covid. Yes, ICU bed counts are high, but as the article stated, there are 278 ICU beds as of last year that can support covid, with 1,000 ICU beds total available.

3rd wave already proved that's a lie. 278 is probably right, 1000 is BS unless you are getting people off cash corner to man those beds.

I don't think nurses have left. But burnout is real, especially with this current wave where ICU mostly consist of anti-vaxxer who maintain they are right.

Like I said, save the hospital. Start up a camp in the parking lots for the unvaccinated and have them manned by students.

[duaner]

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So, you pick & choose the government's hindsight info that fits your estimate?
Because their track record is so good? Like that time on April 7, 2020 when Jason Kenney said "Under the “probable scenario,” we now project that Alberta will hit the peak of infections in mid-May (2020). From the beginning of the outbreak to the end of summer we could see as many as 800,000 total infections, and between 400 and 3,100 deaths."

So yeah, you got me with that ultra credible government hindsight.

So, your rebuttal is that because they failed at predicting the future, they are not credible when admitting they made a mistake in the past? Really? I estimated nothing; I provided numbers, actual data, that show when the cases began increasing again.

[ExtraSlow]

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I don't think nurses have left. But burnout is real, especially with this current wave where ICU mostly consist of anti-vaxxer who maintain they are right.

Nurses have pretty flexible policies regarding time off, sick leave, stress-related disability leave, and if they've been around the system long, they probably haver a pile of unused vacation hours. I don't blame them for using the system to get themselves some time away from this shitshow.

[ThePenIsMightier]

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So, your rebuttal is that because they failed at predicting the future, they are not credible when admitting they made a mistake in the past? Really? I estimated nothing; I provided numbers, actual data, that show when the cases began increasing again.

I don't know much. Neither do you and neither does the government. We should all keep that in mind. It's a complex, multi-variable situation.

My feeling is that if the loosened restrictions of Canada Day were more to blame, the stats would've gone from exponential to vertical in way the fuck fewer than 9 weeks, particularly considering that Stampede was in there.

I can't prove myself right; but, Dr. Hinshaw saying "sorry" doesn't prove me wrong, either.

[redline]

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Once again, its bullshit. An incompetent gov and AHS has caused this, not much of anything to do with covid. Yes, ICU bed counts are high, but as the article stated, there are 278 ICU beds as of last year that can support covid, with 1,000 ICU beds total available.

i agree the gov is incompetent but please show me the fact we have 1000 ICU beds. they have created surge beds and without those beds, we would currently be at 123% of ICU capacity and currently at 90% with the surge beds. AHS is canceling mass amounts surgeries to free up space and Kenney still has his head up his ass...


Nurses are not always interchangeable. ICU and other wards have specialized training that nurses have to take to be able to work on those wards.

[Buster]

Dont give ICU access to unvaccinated covid patients.

That solves a number of problems all at once.

[duaner]

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You should always question when someone states what they think, without any background info as to why.

We've had people isolating/social distancing from each other since the start, it clearly doesn't work unless we have full lockdowns, which obviously will curtail spread, but also ruin the economy.

And if people aren't going to get vaccinated regardless, the lockdowns will continue.

You'll have to go back a couple of pages to understand my point.

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As for ICU capacity and nurses not being available (a complete, absolute bullshit claim):

ICU strategy
https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.cbc.ca/amp/1.5723342

What does an article from Sept. 2020 have to do with anything this year? Just go to the Alberta site: https://www.alberta.ca/stats/covid-1...hcare-capacity

As for nurses, they are being pulled from other units to work in the ICU, as long as they have the relevant training. This puts strain on those other units as they have to do the same work with fewer staff.

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We have 1,000 more nurses than in 2020, and yet we are still short?? What?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/globaln...el-notley/amp/

Alot of this has nothing to do with covid and everything to do with an inept government and healthcare system.

That whole article is about the problems being seen with too few staff. A lot of it has as much to do with COVID as everything else, hence the need for 1,000 more nurses.

[nzwasp]

As much as I respect that the doctors from "protect our province" have started their own PR conferences to get the word out about how bad it is here they do have some collapse doomers among their group. For instance yesterday one guy said "there will be a lockdown, either one done by the province when the hospitals are bursting at the seems or one from our hospital system collapsing" I think even if our hospital system had collapsed (and im unsure what that looks like) people would still be going about their business as per normal in this province.

[jutes]

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Like I said, save the hospital. Start up a camp in the parking lots for the unvaccinated and have them manned by students.

This is the overall solution and with winter coming hospitals will only get more crowded.

Free healthcare for all*

*Vaccinations and conditions apply.

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Really? You can't believe someone when they tell you a reasonable response that they don't know the answer since there is not much data on the subject of durability? You rather be a goof and spout stuff in absolutes?

I know everyone is ignoring you and whatnot, but seriously you're so delusional it's a bit pathetic. It really has nothing to do with Covid, but how you comprehend data and how bias you are towards your own beliefs.

Now I 100% question your approach when you've dealt with Airways Brake and Muffler and how they damaged your front lip.

Don't bother with him, he won't reply to you. He/She/they log-on in the middle of the night to copy/paste nonsense and leave. Same thing over and over.

[duaner]

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I don't know much. Neither do you and neither does the government. We should all keep that in mind. It's a complex, multi-variable situation.

My feeling is that if the loosened restrictions of Canada Day were more to blame, the stats would've gone from exponential to vertical in way the fuck fewer than 9 weeks, particularly considering that Stampede was in there.

I can't prove myself right; but, Dr. Hinshaw saying "sorry" doesn't prove me wrong, either.

So now you're arguing to your feelings, which somehow tell you that the numbers would have been more "vertical"? I prefer data. Here is a little perspective: as of yesterday, there was almost a 9% increase in COVID ICU admissions and we were at about 27% fewer active cases (18,395) than the previous high (25,129). Active cases were at only 573 on July 16--they were in steady decline until then. We went from 573 to 18,395 cases in just under two months, beginning on July 17, just over two weeks after restrictions were lifted. By the time the numbers are out on Thursday, there will likely be a gain of over 18,000 active cases within two months. That's a gain probably as steep as any that we've had.

[zechs]

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i agree the gov is incompetent but please show me the fact we have 1000 ICU beds.

Literally in the CBC article I posted. Just because AHS is a bunch of fuckwitted twats actually has little to do with Kenney. In fact, one might even think they have something to gain by being complete fucking retards about covid and laying it at the premier's feet. Hmm

[Xtrema]

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Literally in the CBC article I posted. Just because AHS is a bunch of fuckwitted twats actually has little to do with Kenney. In fact, one might even think they have something to gain by being complete fucking retards about covid and laying it at the premier's feet. Hmm

We are going in circles. This was mentions on last 3 waves. Do we want to pay for extra capacity that won't be used and call it be prepared?

Does healthcare even works on JIT model?

[sabad66]

4 years to train an RN. 8+ years to train a doctor.

And people still think icu capacity scaling is as easy as flipping on an AWS instance.

[ExtraSlow]

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4 years to train an RN. 8+ years to train a doctor.

And people still think icu capacity scaling is as easy as flipping on an AWS instance.

well, you don't have to start with someone local with no training, there are people all over north america and Europe who have already started their training and who will be looking for jobs every year. But yeah, it's a bit of a turnaround.

[Xtrema]

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As much as I respect that the doctors from "protect our province" have started their own PR conferences to get the word out about how bad it is here they do have some collapse doomers among their group. For instance yesterday one guy said "there will be a lockdown, either one done by the province when the hospitals are bursting at the seems or one from our hospital system collapsing" I think even if our hospital system had collapsed (and im unsure what that looks like) people would still be going about their business as per normal in this province.

The point of lock down/curfew is to reduce chances of someone needing ICU. Like whoever is drunk enough to launch his/her car thru a bus bench and 2 trees in Hamptons 2 nights ago.

But again, there is no reason to punish the 80% that took the shots. Vaccine passport is the only fair solution with minimal economic impact.

BTW, what's a crushed up intercooler worth in recycling value? Still on the ground in a pile as of yesterday.

[kenny]

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Dont give ICU access to unvaccinated covid patients.

That solves a number of problems all at once.

This is part of the plan (sorta). They updated the triage protocol back in March/April of this year I think with new learnings from Covid.

Vaccination status isn't specifically mentioned, but they are to provide hospital resources to those that stand the best chance to survive.

I still like my designated hospital in AHS region for unvaxxed patients/staff idea. I think that would convince more people to get vaxxed than passports or gift cards.

[TurboMedic]

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well, you don't have to start with someone local with no training, there are people all over north america and Europe who have already started their training and who will be looking for jobs every year. But yeah, it's a bit of a turnaround.

Do tell, what attracts these people to Alberta? A government that attacks public sector at any chance it can? A toxic work environment called AHS? For the record I know plenty of health care workers (Paramedics, Nurses, Physicians) that have left, both their jobs and the province, voluntarily I might add, to work in jurisdictions that pay/support/work life balance better. There is honestly nothing attractive about working in Alberta in health care.

[RawB8figure]

If you think they are under staffed now wait until Oct. 31 when AHS vaccine mandate goes into affect.
Booster that are going to be required to deal with the variants are only going to cause more people to become hesitant as time goes on.
We need better solution's ,but I don't think we will get them as the leaders are using this issue as a tool to divide and conquer. You can easily see this just by reading the comments here.

[Disoblige]

Lol I got neg repped responding to SportEL
Even associating with him gets you red.

[ExtraSlow]

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Do tell, what attracts these people to Alberta? A government that attacks public sector at any chance it can? A toxic work environment called AHS? For the record I know plenty of health care workers (Paramedics, Nurses, Physicians) that have left, both their jobs and the province, voluntarily I might add, to work in jurisdictions that pay/support/work life balance better. There is honestly nothing attractive about working in Alberta in health care.

I have not compared the attractiveness of various jurisdictions, and I don't think there's a fair way to do that. I guess, if AHS put out a recruitment call for X nurses, are they able to fill all those slots that they want to hire for? If no, then we have a problem that needs to be addressed.

I have no doubt some have left, and I even believe that AHS is less attractive then previously. That's not great, doesn't make me feel good.