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  1. #301
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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    I don't care if binky the clown was installed as the head of the USPS.

    If your anti-voter-suppression dreams are reliant on the USPS or CP, then your plan is bad.
    It's simply one of many voter suppression tactics that together add up to something that will likely be significant. Republican elections have always relied on voter suppression, and that's something they have said themselves.

    Mail in ballots will probably be huge this year, so I wouldn't underestimate the effect installing another one of Trump's yes-men at the head of the USPS will have.
    Last edited by Mitsu3000gt; 08-13-2020 at 12:27 PM.

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    Wouldn’t it just make sense to spread voting out over say a 30 day period to minimize crowding at polling stations? Put a hard ban in Camapigning during that period?

    Your last name starts with A you go to this poll any of these 5 days etc.

    This isn’t rocket science.

    If we can manage to make a Costco safe during covid surely we can figure out voting.

    Mass mail in ballots are literally insane.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    Wouldn’t it just make sense to spread voting out over say a 30 day period to minimize crowding at polling stations? Put a hard ban in Camapigning during that period?

    Your last name starts with A you go to this poll any of these 5 days etc.

    This isn’t rocket science.

    If we can manage to make a Costco safe during covid surely we can figure out voting.

    Mass mail in ballots are literally insane.
    One would think .... but that requires logic and it won't have the media blitz that the election brings. Republicans could expand early voting if they wanted to ... but they don't. In fact they were fighting early voting in the 2018 election as well.

    Even for mail in voting, you could have ballots arrive the whole week of the election so there's no concerns about delays but instead many states require your ballot to arrive on election day or it doesn't count. Even if you mailed it 2-3 days before the election and it arrives the day after the election it's void.

    Why exactly do you think mass mail in ballots are insane?
    Last edited by pheoxs; 08-13-2020 at 01:44 PM.
    Nolan

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    Mass mail-in ballots are fine (under normal circumstances when no controlled by a corrupt president haha). It's no more chaotic than millions of people showing up all at once to the polls on election day.

    Anything that increases voter participation or security is vehemently opposed by the GOP who also control the Senate, so it doesn't matter what good ideas people have, it won't even get looked at.
    Last edited by Mitsu3000gt; 08-13-2020 at 01:50 PM.

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    mail in ballots are a shitty way to vote, with an infrastructure run by a shitty gov't bureaucracy.

    If you have to choose between voter suppression and voter fraud, I'll take suppression erry day.

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    I don’t really understand how people think having to prove your identity and citizenship to vote (prerequisites) is a bad thing.

    No way to do that accurate and efficiently via Mail.

    “Voter suppression” is a hilarious concept.

    We are trying to currently do the Mail in bs for the CPC leadership race and you need to send in a photocopy of your id along with the ballot, oh and you need to send it nearly a month in advance because Canada Post is useless. That’s for a few hundred thousand registered CPC members who are actually voting. And people want to try that with hundreds of millions of voters in a country where being able to spell is a debatable assumption for many voters?

    Is requiring you to read a ballot voter suppression to? Maybe we should just have the whole country raise their hands at once in zoom to determine the president.

    Also the quotes I have been reading of needing 10’s of billions of dollars of funding to USPS to pull off Mail in voting, you can all do the math on how much this election will cost per vote lmao
    Last edited by killramos; 08-13-2020 at 02:30 PM.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    I don’t really understand how people think having to prove your identity and citizenship to vote (prerequisites) is a bad thing.

    No way to do that accurate and efficiently via Mail.

    “Voter suppression” is a hilarious concept.

    We are trying to currently do the Mail in bs for the CPC leadership race and you need to send in a photocopy of your id along with the ballot, oh and you need to send it nearly a month in advance because Canada Post is useless. That’s for a few hundred thousand registered CPC members who are actually voting. And people want to try that with hundreds of millions of voters in a country where being able to spell is a debatable assumption for many voters?

    Is requiring you to read a ballot voter suppression to? Maybe we should just have the whole country raise their hands at once in zoom to determine the president.

    Also the quotes I have been reading of needing 10’s of billions of dollars of funding to USPS to pull off Mail in voting, you can all do the math on how much this election will cost per vote lmao
    The mail in voter thing and the pearl clutching over it being voter suppression is pretty much just TDSing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    I don’t really understand how people think having to prove your identity and citizenship to vote (prerequisites) is a bad thing.

    No way to do that accurate and efficiently via Mail.

    “Voter suppression” is a hilarious concept.

    We are trying to currently do the Mail in bs for the CPC leadership race and you need to send in a photocopy of your id along with the ballot, oh and you need to send it nearly a month in advance because Canada Post is useless. That’s for a few hundred thousand registered CPC members who are actually voting. And people want to try that with hundreds of millions of voters in a country where being able to spell is a debatable assumption for many voters?

    Is requiring you to read a ballot voter suppression to? Maybe we should just have the whole country raise their hands at once in zoom to determine the president.

    Also the quotes I have been reading of needing 10’s of billions of dollars of funding to USPS to pull off Mail in voting, you can all do the math on how much this election will cost per vote lmao
    So it's safe to deliver social security cheques by mail, safe to mail tax information by mail, safe to mail drivers licenses by mail but not safe to mail ballots? Why exactly?

    Register ahead of time -> Mail ballots with serial numbers on them -> return ballots and count them. Unless you are expecting some kind of massive mail heist where someone rolls through the neighbhour hood stealing everyones ballots where is the issue?
    Nolan

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    If mass mail in balloting was a good idea what was stopping us from doing it until now?

    “Safe” is a weird word to use, I don’t think anyone is implying mail in ballots represent danger. But ultimately there is no way to verify that the person who fills in a ballot is actually who they say they are. I can’t even stand behind my grandpa at a polling station while he votes, or walk his ballot over to the collecting receptical, these were all things we considered important until 15 minutes ago.

    The real question is whether you think secure, verified, unpressured voting is important to you or not. TDSers as Buster mentioned, seem to not care that much about this.

    I also see little to no reason as to why we can’t just have polling stations open, but just spread the voting out more such that fewer people are there at once. If polling takes 2-3 months who cares, takes away a ton of the spectacle of election night but that is a pretty dumb reason and reality if mail in voting happens anyway.

    One thing I know for sure, letting the government do something this massive and in a Centralized way is a guaranteed way to end up cocking the whole thing up. It’s just in their nature.
    Last edited by killramos; 08-13-2020 at 03:03 PM.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    If mass mail in balloting was a good idea what was stopping us from doing it until now?

    “Safe” is a weird word to use, I don’t think anyone is implying mail in ballots represent danger. But ultimately there is no way to verify that the person who fills in a ballot is actually who they say they are. I can’t even stand behind my grandpa at a polling station while he votes, or walk his ballot over to the collecting receptical, these were all things we considered important until 15 minutes ago.

    The real question is whether you think secure, verified, unpressured voting is important to you or not. TDSers as Buster mentioned, seem to not care that much about this.

    I also see little to no reason as to why we can’t just have polling stations open, but just spread the voting out more such that fewer people are there at once. If polling takes 2-3 months who cares, takes away a ton of the spectacle of election night but that is a pretty dumb reason and reality if mail in voting happens anyway.

    One thing I know for sure, letting the government do something this massive and in a Centralized way is a guaranteed way to end up cocking the whole thing up. It’s just in their nature.
    Nothing... Colorado, Oregon, Utah, and Washington have been doing mail in voting for all for multiple elections now and no issues. Many other states have been doing no-excuse absentee voting for years as well (Meaning anyone can request a ballot by mail without needing to specify a reason). Absentee ballots and mail in voting are the exact same thing. Hell even Trump voted Absentee last election.

    Why do you think it's okay to vote by mail for some but not for all?
    Nolan

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    Define no issues? The problem with mass mail in balloting is its impossible to tell what the issues are lol.

    I guess no one complained so that’s good?

    I think it’s one thing for a small minority of people to do something, where it is far more easily tracked, than to do it by the hundreds of millions where problems are more easily obfuscated.

    I don’t think anyone should be allowed to vote by mail without a good reason, and I don’t think being scared of covid is a good reason. Get your lazy ass to a poll if you want your vote to count.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    I don’t think anyone should be allowed to vote by mail without a good reason, and I don’t think being scared of covid is a good reason. Get your lazy ass to a poll if you want your vote to count.
    What about old people? We all know risk of severe complications/death is way higher once you are 65+, so do you not think its a valid excuse if you're old? How about other high risk people or people that live with high risk people? You can see how this starts to get really messy if you have to provide some sort of reason for mail in ballot, which is why universal/no-questions-asked ballots are the way to go.



    Ultimately its pretty sad that such a benign and beneficial thing is being politicized like this. Encouraging mail in voting during a pandemic should be a universally accepted bi partisan thing, but I guess its not surprising with this POTUS.


    EDIT: i want to clarify that I don't like the idea of automatically mailing ballots to every registered voter so much and i can understand some arguments against that. I think the best way to do this would be to take Michigan's approach where they mail a ballot request form to people so that people actually have to explicitly request a mail in ballot (but don't have to provide a reason for doing so). That way it gives people a choice - if you want to vote in person then go ahead, but if you want to do it by mail for any reason whatsoever then that's fine too.
    Last edited by sabad66; 08-13-2020 at 05:07 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sabad66 View Post
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    What about old people? We all know risk of severe complications/death is way higher once you are 65+, so do you not think its a valid excuse if you're old? How about other high risk people or people that live with high risk people? You can see how this starts to get really messy if you have to provide some sort of reason for mail in ballot, which is why universal/no-questions-asked ballots are the way to go.



    Ultimately its pretty sad that such a benign and beneficial thing is being politicized like this. Encouraging mail in voting during a pandemic should be a universally accepted bi partisan thing, but I guess its not surprising with this POTUS.
    Depends how obtuse you want to be about the phrase “without a good reason”.

    I want to sit on my couch eating Doritos while collecting welfare, not a good reason. I am at a high risk of death by being in public, good reason. Easily solved since you should know the age of the person voting (since mail in voting is soooooo secure) or can otherwise include a doctors note.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
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    I wouldn't mind a US president that can admit that it was founded on slavery and communism.

    White people tend to forget that their great grandfather probably got divvied up 160 acres for simply setting foot in America. Freedom and Capitalism came much much later in history, some say it never fully took hold. If it was Trump vs McCain, I'd vote Trump for sure though.
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    Should the USA pay reparations of $12 Trillion? Realistically if the nations debt is already at $20 Trillion, whats another 12 stretched over a decade? Should the USA simply give $1 million to every born american?
    Combustion engine cars - Bwahaha.

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    We worried Biden is going to trip and fall down the stairs without his alert bracelet on?
    The whole dementia thing he is playing up(whether it's real or not) seems poised to have his VP step in as President if by some miracle he won the election.



    Quote Originally Posted by The_Rural_Juror View Post
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    That's an insult to Kamala, sir. She's fricking intelligent and one of my favorites from the list of possible candidates. Also a moderate dem. She could be president in a few years. Sarah Palin's not in the same league.

    She is a "moderate" in your eyes? My god, how far has the bar slid that a gun grabbing race baiter could be considered moderate now.


    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    Well Trump came out and said the quiet part out loud again this morning. Claiming that USPS can't handle mail-in voting unless it receives additional funding then in the same interview admits he's blocking funding for USPS
    Trump is supposed to be staying quiet about election fraud and potentially over funding the shit out of USPS just to ensure that election fraud takes place?


    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    Register ahead of time -> Mail ballots with serial numbers on them -> return ballots and count them. Unless you are expecting some kind of massive mail heist where someone rolls through the neighbhour hood stealing everyones ballots where is the issue?
    Yeah cause that has never happened before.....................

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    How exactly is Trump going to manipulate the voting?

    Russians again?
    The left - Russian interference won Trump the 2016 election!

    Everyone - Evidence!

    The left - Interference, orange man bad!

    Also the Left - Mail in ballots are safe, no one can interfere in elections!

    Everyone - https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/25/polit...ges/index.html

    https://www.theblaze.com/news/fake-d...-china-chicago

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/23/polit...cam/index.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by zechs View Post
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    The left - Russian interference won Trump the 2016 election!

    Everyone - Evidence!

    The left - Interference, orange man bad!

    Also the Left - Mail in ballots are safe, no one can interfere in elections!

    Everyone - https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/25/polit...ges/index.html

    https://www.theblaze.com/news/fake-d...-china-chicago

    https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/23/polit...cam/index.html
    Is this an attempt to just throw everything at the wall and see what sticks?

    Russia interference in the election had nothing to do with fraudulent ballots. It has everything to do with funneling money into Republicans winning, examples being the NRA which has since been disbanded, as well as online manipulation of information through troll farms / fake accounts / pushing right wing media / etc. Trying to use that as a defense just makes you sound like an idiot because they're two completely different issues.

    And two of those links would all be solved by universal mail in ballots ... one person running a polling station and trying to stuff extra ballots in doesn't work when the ballots are all coded and distributed at the state level. And the one about fake IDs wouldn't affect mail in ballots either because you'd have to register those IDs with the state which wouldn't line up with any social security, tax history, residency and such. Plus the IDs use real barcodes which are likely cloned from other IDs meaning if you tried to register it would flag it as two IDs having the same bar code.

    But thanks for those links, those actually support why there should be universal mail in ballots, it keeps all the ballot creation at the state level and prevents individuals or small groups from trying to manipulate things.
    Nolan

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    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    the NRA which has since been disbanded,
    wait, the NRA has been disbanded? Really?
    Make the world a radder place, grow a mullet.
    Public Mobile is the best, just like Phil Collins haggard face.

    Quote Originally Posted by The_Rural_Juror
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    no one gives maritimers shit for culturally appropriating donairs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    wait, the NRA has been disbanded? Really?
    Err, my bad I guess not disbanded yet but they've filed a lawsuit to do so. I thought I read it'd gone through but it was just filing the suit.

    The state attorney general's office filed a civil lawsuit Thursday seeking to dissolve the National Rifle Association, a registered charity, alleging its executives diverted millions of dollars from the group to pay for vacations and cover other personal expenses.
    https://www.pressrepublican.com/news...431ad1b7d.html

    https://www.rollingstone.com/politic...-asset-891859/
    Nolan

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