Trudeau's $9 Billion Extravaganza

[civic_stylez]

Buying votes.

I agree that most students will just buy food, booze and weed with it anyways so its a good way to make sure it goes into the local economy.

[revelations]

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Because Alberta MPs have ZERO influence on anything at the Federal level...

As much I would like to emotionally agree with that statement, the logical side still would point out that, especially with the minority liberal clown car show in power, the average AB MP can make a difference.

[kertejud2]

Lucky, freeloading students. Getting basically the equivalent of minimum wage EI for 4 months before going back to their socialist institutions. At least only redistribute the wealth to the poor students!

[duaner]

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Lucky, freeloading students. Getting basically the equivalent of minimum wage EI for 4 months before going back to their socialist institutions. At least only redistribute the wealth to the poor students!

No more freeloading than anyone else who gets CERB assistance.

[davidI]

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As much I would like to emotionally agree with that statement, the logical side still would point out that, especially with the minority liberal clown car show in power, the average AB MP can make a difference.

The Liberals run everything by the BQ and NDP and if they have support there then they go with their plan.

CPC has little input on anything and they're not going to vote against this since "free money" is very appealing to most of the population who have no care about Canada's fiscal siutation, which is exactly why the Liberals and NPD managed to garner the votes they did to begin with.

[killramos]

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No more freeloading than anyone else who gets CERB assistance.

Except at least CERB beneficiaries have had to prove they had income before to be eligible.

[davidI]

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No more freeloading than anyone else who gets CERB assistance.

Except that when I was a post-secondary student the majority of students didn't even try to find summer jobs...

If someone has statistics to prove me wrong on that I'd appreciate it given my view is completely observational from more than a decade ago.

[killramos]

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Except that when I was a post-secondary student the majority of students didn't even try to find summer jobs...

If someone has statistics to prove me wrong on that I'd appreciate it given my view is completely observational from more than a decade ago.

Hey taking 3 courses a semester to be a full time student is hard. They need that time off and it would just not be ethical to give them some spending money while we are at it.

[duaner]

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Except at least CERB beneficiaries have had to prove they had income before to be eligible.

That is true but most students these days work while in school. What else are students supposed to do if there simply are too few jobs to be had for summer? Most who work during summer need that money to be able to return to school. If we want students to becomes contributing members of society, then they need to be able to continue with their education. Of course, they could just take out student loans, which they will have to repay.

We'll just have to wait and see what the government comes up with as nothing is set in stone yet.

[msommers]

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Except that when I was a post-secondary student the majority of students didn't even try to find summer jobs...

If someone has statistics to prove me wrong on that I'd appreciate it given my view is completely observational from more than a decade ago.

Here is something from Stats Canada exactly a decade ago:

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/p...df?st=31TKTKPZ

Conclusions

Although most students have consistently worked during the summer months, employment patterns during the school year have changed substantially. Since the late 1990s, almost one in two full-time postsecondary students has been employed during the academic school year, up from one in four in the late 1970s. At the same time, hours at work rose and then levelled off, averaging around 16 per week over the past decade.

In the 2009/2010 school year, not only were there proportionally more women age 15 to 24 attending postsecondary school than men (56% versus 44%), but they were also more likely to be employed (50% versus 40%). However, on average, employed male students worked longer weekly hours than their female counterparts—16.7 compared with 15.3. Older stud-dents and Canadian-born students were also significantly more likely to work while attending school.

Almost all employed students worked in the service sector (96%), with 36% in the retail trade and 18% in food services.

Students have not been immune to the recent economic downturn as they experienced a drop in their employment rate and average hours worked. The full-time postsecondary student employment rate fell by over 3 percentage points between the fall 2008 term and the winter 2009 term. Although the rate increased to 46.5% during the winter 2010 term, the rate is still lower than the fall 2007 term rate of 47.9%. Many students rely on employment earnings to help fund their education (Ouellette 2006). The estimated school-year earnings of those with a job were about $6,000 before and during the economic downturn (2007/2008 to 2009/2010). Even though students with a job managed to hold their ground in terms of earn-ins, there were an estimated 30,000 fewer students with jobs over the period.

The summer of 2009 was the worst labor market for postsecondary students age 20 to 24 since the recession years of 1982 and 1993. Between the summers of 2008 and 2009, the employment rate dropped from 70.3% to 63.0%, the unemployment rate increased from 9.0% to 13.6%, and the percentage with a full-time job dropped from 60.7% to 56.6%. It is particularly difficult for students to be jobless during the summer due to the potential earnings loss. Students who were employed during the summer of 2009 earned $6,700 on average. The recent declines in the school-year and summer student employment rates due to the economic down-turn, and subsequent increase in the unemployment rate, suggests more students would have been work-in at a paid job if they could have found one. How-ever, most college and university programs last for several years, and with signs that student employment is starting to recover, students wanting work may soon have a better chance of being employed again.

[Misterman]

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I'm gonna go against the grain here and say the student benefit is probably one of the better ways to inject cash into the economy. We've seen in the past corporate bailouts happen and then somehow CEOs are still pulling record bonuses and then money is funneled into stock buybacks so how much does that actually help the workers keep their jobs.

But let's be real, most students are pretty shitty with their money. If you give them 1,500 a month guess what, they're going to blow it on food, booze, merchandise, etc. All of that is cash re-injected into the economy into other peoples hands. It helps out the restaurants and the stores indirectly. Even if they're smart and save most of it for books/school that still helps support our public education system as well. At the end of the year nearly all that money will be re-spent into our economy whereas tax breaks for the rich/corporations will just get pushed into some kind of investment fund or leaves the country.

This is a poor argument for student free money. If we want to help the economy, then cut out the middle man(the student) and just give cash directly to struggling business.

Personally, sure I feel bad for students, just as I feel for anyone who has been economically struggling due this government overreach we are going through. But where does this end? My grandchildren will be paying for this royal fuck up. And ironically, the only people not covered by any of this relief funding, are the people that were laid off due to Liberals last 5 years of fuck ups and almost out of EI. Those poor bastards are going to have it hard.

I'd be a lot more in support of this free money for all thing the Libs are doing, if it had a caveat attached of being an interest free loan. Then only people that need it would use it, and those that use it would be more frugal with the money they received.

[revelations]

Folks, we have entered a new phase of Canadian fiscal process entirely. Debt is good.

Money will be handed out like candy. Short term gain for long term pain. Any CPC government coming in will not be able to do much about the insane debt loading besides print more money - or other unconventional monetary policies.

The CAD will become worthless within our lifetime. Plan accordingly. Cash/FIAT is bad (devalued) but debt is good (also devalued).

A 500,000$ mortgage suddenly doesn't look so bad when a new car is worth 200,000$ CAD.

[lasimmon]

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Folks, we have entered a new phase of Canadian fiscal process entirely. Debt is good.

Money will be handed out like candy. Short term gain for long term pain. Any CPC government coming in will not be able to do much about the insane debt loading besides print more money - or other unconventional monetary policies.

The CAD will become worthless within our lifetime. Plan accordingly. Cash/FIAT is bad (devalued) but debt is good (also devalued).

A 500,000$ mortgage suddenly doesn't look so bad when a new car is worth 200,000$ CAD.

I don't think we will see a CPC majority in Canada ever again - not as the party is made up now anyway.

[davidI]

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Here is something from Stats Canada exactly a decade ago:

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/en/p...df?st=31TKTKPZ

Thanks for the link. The article says "Since thelate 1990s, almost one in two full-time postsecondarystudents have been employed during the academicschool year, up from one in four in the late 1970s." and later in the table shows 45% being employed through the school year.

Maybe I don't understand the CERB well enough, but wouldn't that mean that in this case, 45% of the students would already be receiving CERB? (I realize they may work more hours in the summer but they're already receiving 'free' money).

If the summer employment rate was 63%, wouldn't that only be 18% more than the students who work through the year and already qualify for CERB? Meanwhile, the 37% who didn't work at all will also get the free money?

Again, tough to argue without full statistics but when money is given out by the government without much statistical support or justification I tend to question the rationale behind it - particularly when it's a Liberal/NDP government that receives a lot of support from post-secondary students.

As others have said, super low interest student loans could have been an option for those in need of additional financial support due to the situation.

[pheoxs]

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Folks, we have entered a new phase of Canadian fiscal process entirely. Debt is good.

Money will be handed out like candy. Short term gain for long term pain. Any CPC government coming in will not be able to do much about the insane debt loading besides print more money - or other unconventional monetary policies.

The CAD will become worthless within our lifetime. Plan accordingly. Cash/FIAT is bad (devalued) but debt is good (also devalued).

A 500,000$ mortgage suddenly doesn't look so bad when a new car is worth 200,000$ CAD.

You make the assumption that wages rise to pay off that debt down the road.

[sabad66]

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Except that when I was a post-secondary student the majority of students didn't even try to find summer jobs...

If someone has statistics to prove me wrong on that I'd appreciate it given my view is completely observational from more than a decade ago.

I'd be interested in hard numbers too, but my anecdotal experience from 2006-2011 was that everyone i knew in University had summer jobs of some sort. But then again, i was brought up in a poorer neighbourhood which naturally means most of my circle were also not well off and had to work if they wanted any semblance of a social life over summer.

[lasimmon]

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I'd be interested in hard numbers too, but my anecdotal experience from 2006-2011 was that everyone i knew in University had summer jobs of some sort. But then again, i was brought up in a poorer neighbourhood which naturally means most of my circle were also not well off and had to work if they wanted any semblance of a social life over summer.

Same time frame for me and everyone worked as well.

[revelations]

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You make the assumption that wages rise to pay off that debt down the road.

I actually didnt even consider it, but you have raised another point - wages stagnate along with debt, but the cost of living goes sky high. Therefore debt does not 'decrease' in that sense.

I'm definitely no expert on any of this, just musing here at a possible, down the road (eg. 2-3 year?) outcome for Canada.

- - - Updated - - -

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I don't think we will see a CPC majority in Canada ever again - not as the party is made up now anyway.

I can see coalition governments being made down the road.

[rx7boi]

On reddit, there were a couple of posters who contemplated voluntarily reducing their employment hours to earn less than $1000 a month so they could qualify for CESB.

Some of them worked in grocery stores so I get that they wanted to do that to limit exposure but to me it appears to be is disingenuous and exploitative for obvious reasons. There are people who would give their left nut for a job but have to rely on CERB while they're purposefully leaving employment on the table for what is supposed to be financial recompense.

[Tik-Tok]

There's always going to be people who scam the system (any system), but IMO, it's with it to help those that truly need it.