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Thread: Covid19 Bankruptcy Thread

  1. #721
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    I'll pay my mortgage when the government bails me out.

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    Quote Originally Posted by flipstah View Post
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    https://globalnews.ca/news/7675688/a...-out-exchange/

    Should the gov't bail out AC in exchange for refunding customers?
    That's the wrong question to ask.

    The government offered to bail out AC only if they offered refunds, and AC/union says good to go, your move Trudeau.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

  3. #723
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    No
    X1000

    NO MORE BAILOUTS LET THEM FAIL, this is why we are in the spot we are, if a company cant manage money and survive 1 year without customers it really is poor money managment, I guess this could be why airlines spend all their capital on buybacks.

    This is an American site but I'd be surprised if Air Canada didn't fit in this category..

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...buybacks-chart
    Originally posted by beemerm3
    so if we only seen 5 % of the oceans why not drain them or somethin lol or can u even transfer water from one ocean to another??? think of all the stuff u'd find treasures n eerything.

  4. #724
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    The canadian taxpayers come out pretty far ahead by NOT bailing out AC. Fuck em.
    Stupid people focus on the math, smart people focus on the information.

  5. #725
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kobe View Post
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    X1000

    NO MORE BAILOUTS LET THEM FAIL, this is why we are in the spot we are, if a company cant manage money and survive 1 year without customers it really is poor money managment, I guess this could be why airlines spend all their capital on buybacks.

    This is an American site but I'd be surprised if Air Canada didn't fit in this category..

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...buybacks-chart
    Uh, no.

    No company would be viable if they tied up capital for a year's worth of operations in case of a black swan event. The shareholders would never allow the board/CEO to do that, nor should they.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Uh, no.

    No company would be viable if they tied up capital for a year's worth of operations in case of a black swan event. The shareholders would never allow the board/CEO to do that, nor should they.
    Can you hedge customers?
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    The canadian taxpayers come out pretty far ahead by NOT bailing out AC. Fuck em.
    In most of the bails, the senior management get to keep their sky high salaries and bonuses. While the working level are still expendable and still subject to layoff (eventually).

    Fuck bailing large corporations.
    Originally posted by beyond_ban
    Yo Kanye, ima let you finish, but 50 Cent had the best concert cancellation of all time.

  8. #728
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kobe View Post
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    NO MORE BAILOUTS LET THEM FAIL
    I think you are reading the situation wrong. AC is in no danger of failing. They had a huge cash position prior to covid and still have a ton of cash. Have a look at the balance sheets. The government wants AC to refund passengers their money, which AC is obviously not legally required to do at this point. The bail out would flow through to AC customers as refunds. The business question is whether it makes sense to take the government money and refund passengers, or stay the course.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JustinL View Post
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    I think you are reading the situation wrong. AC is in no danger of failing. They had a huge cash position prior to covid and still have a ton of cash. Have a look at the balance sheets. The government wants AC to refund passengers their money, which AC is obviously not legally required to do at this point. The bail out would flow through to AC customers as refunds. The business question is whether it makes sense to take the government money and refund passengers, or stay the course.
    Then let's give Air Canada the free will to decide if they will continue to steal their customers' money, or not. WestJet hasn't stolen any of my money and if Air Canada wants to conduct themselves that way, the free market can take care of that in the long run.

  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Power_Of_Rotary View Post
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    In most of the bails, the senior management get to keep their sky high salaries and bonuses. While the working level are still expendable and still subject to layoff (eventually).

    Fuck bailing large corporations.
    As always, the trick is to be senior management.

  11. #731
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    Bizarre that more cancelled flyers have not contacted their CC dispute dept. WJ has changed or cancelled several of my flights the last 12 months and on one occasion I was not able to adjust to the schedule change and booked the flight with AC.

    Even though I refused a voucher, they stuck one on me - I contacted the CC dispute dept with details of my contact with the merchant - I was refunded in 3 weeks.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePenIsMightier View Post
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    Then let's give Air Canada the free will to decide if they will continue to steal their customers' money, or not. WestJet hasn't stolen any of my money and if Air Canada wants to conduct themselves that way, the free market can take care of that in the long run.
    Unfortunately the airline industry in Canada is not a true free market and the nature of the services result in 95% of customers choosing the lowest fares regardless of the logo on the plane. This is good for Air Canada though as their customer base really doesnít decrease too much regardless of what happens as long as they offer competitive rates.

    Iím against bail outs of all companies but understand the bail-out argument in very specific instances. This is not one of them. If Air Canada goes tits up there is a basically a 100% chance they, or a near identical entity, will come out the other side offering the same service. The shareholders and debt holders will lose out, which is the risk of any investment, but donít think for 1 second that some form of Air Canada will not continue to operate thereafter whether itís called Air Canada or something else.

    Donít make tax payers cover this bullshit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Type_S1 View Post
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    Unfortunately the airline industry in Canada is not a true free market and the nature of the services result in 95% of customers choosing the lowest fares regardless of the logo on the plane. This is good for Air Canada though as their customer base really doesnít decrease too much regardless of what happens as long as they offer competitive rates.

    Iím against bail outs of all companies but understand the bail-out argument in very specific instances. This is not one of them. If Air Canada goes tits up there is a basically a 100% chance they, or a near identical entity, will come out the other side offering the same service. The shareholders and debt holders will lose out, which is the risk of any investment, but donít think for 1 second that some form of Air Canada will not continue to operate thereafter whether itís called Air Canada or something else.

    Donít make tax payers cover this bullshit.
    Maybe they'll call it "Canadian Airlines".
    No, wait...

  14. #734
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    Quote Originally Posted by Type_S1 View Post
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    Unfortunately the airline industry in Canada is not a true free market and the nature of the services result in 95% of customers choosing the lowest fares regardless of the logo on the plane. This is good for Air Canada though as their customer base really doesn’t decrease too much regardless of what happens as long as they offer competitive rates.

    I’m against bail outs of all companies but understand the bail-out argument in very specific instances. This is not one of them. If Air Canada goes tits up there is a basically a 100% chance they, or a near identical entity, will come out the other side offering the same service. The shareholders and debt holders will lose out, which is the risk of any investment, but don’t think for 1 second that some form of Air Canada will not continue to operate thereafter whether it’s called Air Canada or something else.

    Don’t make tax payers cover this bullshit.
    There is a rumour/view on the AirCanada discussion groups that trudeau is going to be opening up the skies to foreign competition here. Some of the federal decisions are bizarre otherwise on their own. Public wants lower fares. Not sure if this means reciprocal open skies with the foreign entity.

  15. #735
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    Quote Originally Posted by revelations View Post
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    There is a rumour/view on the AirCanada discussion groups that trudeau is going to be opening up the skies to foreign competition here. Some of the federal decisions are bizarre otherwise on their own. Public wants lower fares. Not sure if this means reciprocal open skies with the foreign entity.
    I've been predicting this for years now, but don't believe it will happen quite yet. Trudeau isn't going to piss Quebec off. The next PC premiere might do it though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThePenIsMightier View Post
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    Maybe they'll call it "Canadian Airlines".
    No, wait...
    Air Kanata has a good ring to it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JustinL View Post
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    I think you are reading the situation wrong. AC is in no danger of failing. They had a huge cash position prior to covid and still have a ton of cash. Have a look at the balance sheets. The government wants AC to refund passengers their money, which AC is obviously not legally required to do at this point. The bail out would flow through to AC customers as refunds. The business question is whether it makes sense to take the government money and refund passengers, or stay the course.
    Why are they not legally required to provide a refund? I did a charge back through my credit card and got my money back. I feel if they didn't have any obligation to. That wouldn't have happened. This was with WestJet, but I don't think that makes much of a difference. Also, to note WestJet didn't make it easy, but again, if there was no legal obligation to return my money, I doubt I would have gotten it.
    Also, I hear some airline passengers advocate guy on the radio sayin how they are breaking the law by not returning money.
    Last edited by arcticcat522; 03-08-2021 at 07:30 PM.

  18. #738
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticcat522 View Post
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    Why are they not legally required to provide a refund? I did a charge back through my credit card and got my money back. I feel if they didn't have any obligation to. That wouldn't have happened. This was with WestJet, but I don't think that makes much of a difference. Also, to note WestJet didn't make it easy, but again, if there was no legal obligation to return my money, I doubt I would have gotten it.
    Also, I hear some airline passengers advocate guy on the radio sayin how they are breaking the law by not returning money.
    They changed their cancellation policy in March last year. No refunds, vouchers only for covid related cancellations on non refundable fares.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

  19. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    They changed their cancellation policy in March last year. No refunds, vouchers only for covid related cancellations on non refundable fares.
    Well, would you look at that....just look at it. Thanks

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    Quote Originally Posted by arcticcat522 View Post
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    Well, would you look at that....just look at it. Thanks
    Ya I think every airline did this. Made ambiguous statements to stall chargebacks as well haha.

    Wasn’t just airlines, Montreal f1 race tickets still aren’t refunded yet, almost been a year lol. Hotels were doing the same thing.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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