AT M+S or Winter Tires???

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

4H all the time is going to ruin the driveline. 4A all the time is also going to ruin the driveline, just at a much much slower rate. It should be 2WD in completely dry/wet non slick conditions, 4A in a mix is generally ok, and 4H is for deep snow or off road where there is no chance of driveline wind up.

[tirebob]

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4H all the time is going to ruin the driveline. 4A all the time is also going to ruin the driveline, just at a much much slower rate. It should be 2WD in completely dry/wet non slick conditions, 4A in a mix is generally ok, and 4H is for deep snow or off road where there is no chance of driveline wind up.

Basically if you are on fully slippery or loose surfaces like dirt, gravel, snow, mud etc 4H is fine, but if you are rolling on hard, dry surfaces where the tires have no slip or spin at all under them, 4H is the devil. lol

[Twin_Cam_Turbo]

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Basically if you are on fully slippery or loose surfaces like dirt, gravel, snow, mud etc 4H is fine, but if you are rolling on hard, dry surfaces where the tires have no slip or spin at all under them, 4H is the devil. lol

Yes, even slip stick mix is not good for 4H.

[killramos]

4H basically has no place on pavement.

[bjstare]

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I would say it’s definitely the lesser evil

What am I missing? Isn’t it just 2H until slip occurs, then engage 4H?

Alternatively if it’s full time awd, how is that diff than an suv that runs in ft awd?

[killramos]

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What am I missing? Isn’t it just 2H until slip occurs, then engage 4H?

Alternatively if it’s full time awd, how is that diff than an suv that runs in ft awd?

It’s always 4wd, albeit without a fully locked central tcase and varies torque to front wheels a bit. Not to the degree of 4wd, but I think it reduces front torque to 10-15% rather than locking at 50% in 4Hi.

Still comes with increased tcase wear is my understanding. If that even matters to you over the duration you plan on owning the vehicle. But doesn’t have the risk of binding like locked 4H.

Edit nvm wrong video that’s for awd

[tirebob]

And the effect is magnified if there is a tire circumference difference between the rear tires and front tires as they are consistently turning at different speeds. Not instantly catastrophic or anything, but definitely a wear accelerator.

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It’s always 4wd, albeit without a fully locked central tcase and varies torque to front wheels a bit. Not to the degree of 4wd, but I think it reduces front torque to 10-15% rather than locking at 50% in 4Hi.

Still comes with increased tcase wear is my understanding. If that even matters to you over the duration you plan on owning the vehicle. But doesn’t have the risk of binding like locked 4H.


My understanding is this video explains fords implementation.

[Tik-Tok]

I just drive 4L all the time to avoid this confusion.

[ExtraSlow]

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I just drive 4L all the time to avoid this confusion.

This is the correct choice. Makes more vroom vroom noise too, which is best.

[never]

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This is the correct choice. Makes more vroom vroom noise too, which is best.

And the initial acceleration is much improved!

[Tik-Tok]

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This is the correct choice. Makes more vroom vroom noise too, which is best.

Staying in the power band!

[ExtraSlow]

Most engines make best power bear redline, so I shoot for that.

[suntan]

I'm a 4H virgin, I turn it on occasionally when I hit some icy roads, it worked wonders, I turn it off once I hit clear pavement, so maybe 5 minutes max of it being on, is that okay?

[R-Audi]

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Update.. I ended up swapping tires out.. I decided to get cooper AT3 XLT.

I've had the XLTs for a year now, I think they are slightly worse than duratracs in the snow, but WAY queiter and handle better when dry. Ive been looking at going to a straight winter tire this year, but having troubles deciding on wheels and tires... which wheels... and then which tires then with or without studs. All trying to fit in a certain budget.. fun fun.

[killramos]

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I'm a 4H virgin, I turn it on occasionally when I hit some icy roads, it worked wonders, I turn it off once I hit clear pavement, so maybe 5 minutes max of it being on, is that okay?

Pretty standard usage case

[mzdspd]

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I've had the XLTs for a year now, I think they are slightly worse than duratracs in the snow, but WAY queiter and handle better when dry. Ive been looking at going to a straight winter tire this year, but having troubles deciding on wheels and tires... which wheels... and then which tires then with or without studs. All trying to fit in a certain budget.. fun fun.

Do you have a half ton truck? There are so many good winter options for P rated winter tires. I would probably just bit the bullet and get studded tires.

The main reason that I went with the Coopers is because I am only living in the mountains for this winter.. So a brand new snowflake rated all terrain should work okay. Next winter, hopefully I will be down in the states and will not need a dedicated winter tire.

[R-Audi]

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Do you have a half ton truck? There are so many good winter options for P rated winter tires. I would probably just bit the bullet and get studded tires.

The main reason that I went with the Coopers is because I am only living in the mountains for this winter.. So a brand new snowflake rated all terrain should work okay. Next winter, hopefully I will be down in the states and will not need a dedicated winter tire.

They are on a 4Runner... bit heavier duty than required, but the Coopers have odd sizing restrictions and only snowflakes on certain sizes.. 285/65/18 only came in the 4S and XLT... and the 4S didnt look agressive enough for me but XLTs in that size dont have snowflakes.

[Brent.ff]

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My ZR2 stock tires I believe are Duratracs and though they are brand new, I find them pretty good in winter so far. No real problem with them even in deep snow. Of course occasional minor slips and slides that I feel even winter tires would do. Of course have the truck in 4 high at all times lately as the roads are covered.

This is why i got winters. Driving all the time in 4 High is just dumb, but almost necessary with any level of snow/ice with duratracs.. Winters are such a relief for driving for ski touring up places like highwood pass and 93N

[r3ccOs]

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This is why i got winters. Driving all the time in 4 High is just dumb, but almost necessary with any level of snow/ice with duratracs.. Winters are such a relief for driving for ski touring up places like highwood pass and 93N

So a season with the Nokian R3's so far on the F150 - significantly better than the Cooper AT/W (AT3 winter) - but due to the nature of a truck being light weight bias'd RWD I get why most people just opt with a Snowflake rated tire

Being that I spend MOST of my time with my F150 on-road these days, a Proper Winter tire for my almost weekly commute on the 93 to the vacation property makes sense. I rarely need to put it in 4x4 other than the absolutely inclimate conditions.

Could I get away with a NEW set of Duratracs, Cooper AT/3 W, BFG A/Ts, Nokia Rotiiva... absolutely, just be more often in 4x4 BUT as per Brent, will add additonal drivetrain strain and worse fuel economy.

IF I was back into Backcounry skiing and Hunting - I would definately go with with a good snowflake rated A/T

I would NEVER put a E ply tire on a half ton for Winter - the sidewall flex of a P rated C-ply tire performs substantially better at confirming for on-road conditons

After all that, I would say that the Cooper Discoverer M/S is the perfect Winter tire compromise as an offroading winter tire.

[ThePenIsMightier]

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So a season with the Nokian R3's so far on the F150 - significantly better than the Cooper AT/W (AT3 winter) - but due to the nature of a truck being light weight bias'd RWD I get why most people just opt with a Snowflake rated tire

Being that I spend MOST of my time with my F150 on-road these days, a Proper Winter tire for my almost weekly commute on the 93 to the vacation property makes sense. I rarely need to put it in 4x4 other than the absolutely inclimate conditions.

Could I get away with a NEW set of Duratracs, Cooper AT/3 W, BFG A/Ts, Nokia Rotiiva... absolutely, just be more often in 4x4 BUT as per Brent, will add additonal drivetrain strain and worse fuel economy.

IF I was back into Backcounry skiing and Hunting - I would definately go with with a good snowflake rated A/T

I would NEVER put a E ply tire on a half ton for Winter - the sidewall flex of a P rated C-ply tire performs substantially better at confirming for on-road conditons

After all that, I would say that the Cooper Discoverer M/S is the perfect Winter tire compromise as an offroading winter tire.

Good info, here.