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Thread: Anyone help with potential constructive dismissal case?

  1. #1
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    Default Anyone help with potential constructive dismissal case?

    Wasn't sure whether to put this in the careers section or not, but hoping someone on beyond would have some insight.

    A family friend has worked for an established Canadian retail store for many years now in a store manager position, with over 30 years retail management experience from various places over the years.

    Recently, a new district manager was employed. He's basically a bully and has been trying to weed out anyone from the company who will not blindly say yes to him without question, already causing another manager to quit and cite him and his bullying as the reason. However each time there's a complaint, the HR Department (which is basically one person with an assistant) doesn't do anything on paper and just tells this district manager who's complained and what they've said, rather than any disciplinary action.

    Said family friend was one of the persons who was kept on lay-off due to covid when the stores were allowed to re-open, which they were OK with, since they knew the store had some people with younger families and bills to pay who could use the money more than they could.

    Within days of returning, aforementioned district manager came in and gave F.F their first ever verbal warning, for the store not being in tidy and standard condition, you know, the store that the assistant manager and team leader had been running for the last however many months. FF was aggrieved about this and during his "conversation" he verbally berated her and made ageist comments regarding FFs tenure etc, also berating another store employee who has documented history of addiction problems and has been through rehab and is getting their life back on track (i was especially angry when FF told me about the ageism).

    Within 2 weeks of FF's return, DM came to the store, completely ignored FF and said hello to other employee and started re-arranging the store that had just been organised back to the standards he had given the verbal warning for. As he was just about to leave, he pulled FF to the side and gave them a letter saying they were being transferred from the highest volume store in the city, to the lowest volume one (think going from working in Timmies in Downtown Toronto to working at Timmies in Inuvik). Again he made ageist comments saying that "at this time in life, you'll be looking to slow down and work a M-F, 9-5 store".

    FF had been really struggling due to DMs previous verbal warning and this really put them over the edge. FF went to family doctor who would only sign them off for 3 days on stress leave because "any more is too much paperwork" (no wonder Canada has a mental health problem, but thats another issue). FF followed all company protocols for taking sick time, including finding another staff member to cover their shift and going in to open the store for this person on the first day as they were not a keyholder. She had also logged her sick time in their tracking system properly etc etc.

    When FF returned to work, in a slightly better frame of mind after chatting to some other friends who'd been in a similar position, they were immediately called by the DM to say he'd be coming to the store to speak with them. FF was given a final written warning for "going over on stores allocated hours" by 3 hours. Basically the DM had gone into the time tracking system and changed FFs sick day when they opened for the other employee to show them as working for 3 hours and then sick for 5.5hrs whilst the other employee sits at their full 8.5hr shift. There's the 3 hours that should have been sick time used to give FF a final written.

    FF is devastated. They loved working for this company until this DM started and I honestly feel helpless because all my experiences from the UK have been polar opposite. The doctors take stress at work very seriously and employers actually pay for your counseling should you require it and bullying at work is zero-tolerance

    What advice can I give? This all to me sounds like constructive dismissal should FF end up quitting in order to preserve their health.

    Any employment lawyers or anyone worth calling? They don't have a lot of income between them and their spouse so they're both very worried that DM will find another way to fire them for something so little since this final written.

    Thanks for any advice!

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    Sounds to me like the FF is on her way to being ousted as it is, so whether she remains there largely seems out of her control in the long run. If a higher up wants you out, you're gonna be out - it's that simple. I don't think moving to another store is even an option either, as he would likely continue to give her stress, which from your own account, she can't handle.

    So then the question becomes whether she wants to keep fighting with this guy until she is fired and then find another job, or whether she quits herself. Given she's already stressed out, plus how a firing looks on a resume, the latter seems like the only option. At least then she gets to tell him what she really thinks of him on her own terms - which can be empowering.

    I would not advise she tries to go after him legally, as such cases are hard to prove and it doesn't sound like she has a lot on which to build a case.

    Good luck to your FF.

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    This is an HR issue.

    Have your family friend document every single instance and complaint made to HR.
    If they refuse to act and the bullying continues then you will have a documented case.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kloubek View Post
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    I would not advise she tries to go after him legally, as such cases are hard to prove and it doesn't sound like she has a lot on which to build a case.
    #NorthAmerica right?

    Thanks for the advice man, just hate to see it, having been subject to a bullying manager before I know exactly what its like, however my case for constructive dismissal was enough to frighten the employer since I had everything logged and had a strong witness, they were happy just to give me an equivalent severance and allow me to quit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by vengie View Post
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    This is an HR issue.

    Have your family friend document every single instance and complaint made to HR.
    If they refuse to act and the bullying continues then you will have a documented case.
    They have been, there are emails also

    However as I said, HR aren't taking any of it seriously and have actually told the DM about conversations between the employees and themselves where complaints were being raised

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    Quote Originally Posted by haggis88 View Post
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    #NorthAmerica right?

    Thanks for the advice man, just hate to see it, having been subject to a bullying manager before I know exactly what its like, however my case for constructive dismissal was enough to frighten the employer since I had everything logged and had a strong witness, they were happy just to give me an equivalent severance and allow me to quit.
    I did go to the labour board once as well and managed to get something, though the "evidence" against me (which was 100% fabricated intentionally) was enough that they couldn't get me my job back, nor compensation for the firing. The thing is that he is trying to make it look like he's going through the "proper" channels, so she would have to find a way to prove it's all bogus. Hard to do, and likely more stressful for her than its worth.

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    Lawyrup
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yolobimmer View Post
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    Slash the guys tires, and quit, and move on with your life.
    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    You realize you are talking to the guy who made his own furniture out of salad bowls right?

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    Sounds like Michaels LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by eglove View Post
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    Sounds like Michaels LOL
    I was gonna say Zellers, but they went out years ago. Michaels fits the bill too.

    To the OP: I would suggest that if they are at their wits end and ready to quit anyways, maybe take a hail mary pass and go above HR. Show them the documentation of trying to work with HR and getting zero traction. Putting the pressure on HR might garner some results, but, again, this only serves to rock the boat further. Good luck!
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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Slash the guys tires, and quit, and move on with your life.
    Find out where they live and put nails in their alley, and quit, and move on with your life.

    *not a real recommendation. inspired by real life events.

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    Photoshop DM into a Trump rally and post the picture into CbC comments section.
    Too loud for Aspen

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    Make sure your family friend keeps a tidy record of any and all interactions with district manager. The HR person isn't there to protect your family friend. HR's business is to protect the business and shield them from liability.

    If push comes to shove and this goes further, you have much more credibility if you can list dates/times of who said what.

    What sort of "established Canadian retail store" only has "1 person and an assistant" ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by rx7boi View Post
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    What sort of "established Canadian retail store" only has "1 person and an assistant" ?
    RCSS for one. Each store has an in house HR manager. Would think other large retailers follow this, or something similar with an HR person per cluster/ district.

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    Coukd email the guy who writes this column? He apparently responds.
    https://financialpost.com/executive/...54e340d84/amp/
    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    You realize you are talking to the guy who made his own furniture out of salad bowls right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Coukd email the guy who writes this column? He apparently responds.
    https://financialpost.com/executive/...54e340d84/amp/
    That is rich, no real information besides they are moving offices to a different province, 16 months compensation...

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsingh View Post
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    That is rich, no real information besides they are moving offices to a different province, 16 months compensation...
    Suncor is moving their entire Toronto offices to Calgary. Thats not "constructive dismissal", thats an office closing its doors, lol. You either move, or you're laid off.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tik-Tok View Post
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    Suncor is moving their entire Toronto offices to Calgary. Thats not "constructive dismissal", thats an office closing its doors, lol. You either move, or you're laid off.
    Exactly, and that is when I laugh when I read that either case you are entitled to 16 months compensation.

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    I'd recommend a quick consultation with this guy from RMRF Law. In Edmonton, though but I don't think that really matters.
    https://www.rmrf.com/people/purgas/

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrsingh View Post
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    Exactly, and that is when I laugh when I read that either case you are entitled to 16 months compensation.
    Automatic 16 months is cute. The people in the East get all the breaks.

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