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Thread: Dividend Stocks

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    Default Dividend Stocks

    Bought some dividend paying stocks for the TFSA over the past few years. Recently decided to get more involved in understanding the process since I don't know much about it.

    The plan right now is to diversify over equity sectors that offset each other. Save incoming dividends in a bond fund until there's enough to purchase another new stock, and dollar cost average our monthly contribution to three individual stocks to build them up. These are all long term hold stocks, no plans to move money around here. Doing all of this with advice from our guy at Edward Jones.

    Issues I'm having is really getting in and tracking holdings myself, especially when there is a purchase once a month. At this point I'll take the Excel dump of activity on the account and build a spreadsheet around it, but I'm wondering what anyone else uses to track things like growth from dividend payments and stock value over time.
    Wealthica is one I'm trying since they tie into the Edward Jones portal, but there's some technical issues preventing them from getting our data...so who knows until tech support gets back to me.

    Also wondering what other strategies people are using.

    Apologies if there's another thread about this here, I did a search and didn't find anything specific about investing in these sorts of stocks.

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    XEI and don't bother with a spreadsheet?

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    Or you can comb through the long term investment thread: https://forums.beyond.ca/threads/255...88#post4911188
    Quote Originally Posted by schurchill39 View Post
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    Oh god, don't get him started.

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    Don't worry about dividends, they don't matter.

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    Or this older thread. Still relevant.
    https://forums.beyond.ca/threads/327...eidling-stocks
    Quote Originally Posted by schurchill39 View Post
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    Oh god, don't get him started.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    XEI and don't bother with a spreadsheet?
    I read about ETFs this week but don't know too much about them.

    One thing we did was get into a mutual fund for companies like Google, Facebook, etc rather than purchase those directly. https://www.td.com/ca/en/asset-manag...I/?fundId=1791

    We have one TFSA stock focused and the other has funds. I had planned on learning more about ETF's so I'll probably do that before our next stock purchase.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Don't worry about dividends, they don't matter.
    Can you explain?

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    1) Why dividend stocks? I don't necessarily agree with the "they don't matter" approach, but I also think that people overemphasize their role/importance relative to their actual desired outcome (maximum returns).

    2) You are a prime candidate for someone that should read into the Canadian Couch Potato and the ins/outs of index investing. Mutual Funds are, generally, a ripoff for the typical investor.

    3) Are you tied to Edward Jones for any particular reason? If you are a disciplined investor (AKA: you don't panic when markets fluctuate), you'll likely perform as well or better than a comparative EJ portfolio... only without the management fee.

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    Quote Originally Posted by syscal View Post
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    Can you explain?
    Dividends are not "free money". The money used to pay said dividends are part of the company's valuation, so when dividends are paid, the value of the company (and thus the stock price) adjusts accordingly. So if the company pays out $X in dividends, and the stock price adjusts slightly downward to reflect that, you're not really "ahead" compared to if the stock price had grown by the same percentage.

    Second, dividends are one way that a company can show value to shareholders. Others include buybacks, or reinvestment in the company to grow the business. In any case, if you're wanting to maximize your total return on your investment, whether or not a company pays dividends should be secondary to whether or not you believe in the long-term growth prospects of the business.

    Alaris Royalty (AD.TO) pays a 10% dividend right now. Note the share value change in the past year. XAW (diversified ETF) pays 1.8% in dividends, but look at its share price over the past year. Which is the better investment?

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    Quote Originally Posted by A790 View Post
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    1) Why dividend stocks? I don't necessarily agree with the "they don't matter" approach, but I also think that people overemphasize their role/importance relative to their actual desired outcome (maximum returns).
    I'm glad you are not as lazy as I am to type out the appropriate statement.

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    If these are long term buy and hold stocks, you might wanna look into DRIP investing. It'll reinvest the dividends into the same stock in increments while saving the transaction fees. You also don't have to wait to build up a pool of cash to buy another stock you're interested in.

    Just my less than 2 cents because I too am an investing noob.

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    Did you buy PPL? You probably did.
    How much are you paying this Edward Jones guy? Fire him.
    Quote Originally Posted by 89coupe View Post
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    Beyond, bunch of creme puffs on this board.
    Everything I say is satire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A790 View Post
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    1) Why dividend stocks? I don't necessarily agree with the "they don't matter" approach, but I also think that people overemphasize their role/importance relative to their actual desired outcome (maximum returns).

    2) You are a prime candidate for someone that should read into the Canadian Couch Potato and the ins/outs of index investing. Mutual Funds are, generally, a ripoff for the typical investor.

    3) Are you tied to Edward Jones for any particular reason? If you are a disciplined investor (AKA: you don't panic when markets fluctuate), you'll likely perform as well or better than a comparative EJ portfolio... only without the management fee.
    We were with an unnamed company for many years. At first, before they really grew, they gave a damn and actually helped us build some good equity. The last few years with them were 0% return, for no reason at all. Huge betrayal considering the reason I went with them in the first place.

    Anyway, EJ guy made sense and we've had good returns. Total fees on the stock side sit at about $230/yr without no increase unless we do more transactions, which isn't in the plans right now. At this point I would need to start researching and learning before I'd feel comfortable taking this on myself, so I'm sticking with them as he's been pretty good for us so far.

    Way it sits now, we have RRSP's that just sit there and get adjusted now and again but with no money being added to them. Mutual funds in one TFSA and stocks in the other. Lots of TFSA room still. My understanding right now is that we've diversified over various methods of getting decent returns and the losses due to the economy are balanced out across the portfolio.

    I'm not the panic type, but I don't like to make decisions unless I know all the angles...which would be a curse if I were to attempt day trading or something.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Rural_Juror View Post
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    Did you buy PPL? You probably did.
    How much are you paying this Edward Jones guy? Fire him.
    No PPL.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jltabot View Post
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    If these are long term buy and hold stocks, you might wanna look into DRIP investing. It'll reinvest the dividends into the same stock in increments while saving the transaction fees. You also don't have to wait to build up a pool of cash to buy another stock you're interested in.

    Just my less than 2 cents because I too am an investing noob.
    Yea, I'm on the fence on the build-up/drip on the payments. Build-up means I don't need to save up a lump sum, so that cash goes into monthly purchases of more stock. Either way I'm saving money for the next stock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A790 View Post
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    Alaris Royalty (AD.TO) pays a 10% dividend right now. Note the share value change in the past year. XAW (diversified ETF) pays 1.8% in dividends, but look at its share price over the past year. Which is the better investment?
    Does that hold true over the long term though? You'd only see yield positive growth if you sold the stock after that year, no? Buying more stock month over month and Alaris might be the better choice no? (on the assumption you believe the stock will increase...)

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    greaterfool.ca read 6 years worth of his posts... Long, long term, TFSA should be growth focused and diversified via a lot more than 3 stocks. If dividends are what you want buy the above ETF. Here's what mine's split betweeen - all boring ETFs that the bitcoin / option ballers will piss on...

    DXP
    FCIQ
    PDC
    VWO
    VWO
    XSP

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    Disappointed face.

    Day trading's stupid. Don't do it. Index investing is better for most people, but the time to pour everything into it was earlier this year. Right now, you are looking at a fucked up global economy lead by the incompetent US with relatively high unemployment and conglomeration of value. Indices will likely underperform but still better than 0%.
    Quote Originally Posted by 89coupe View Post
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    Beyond, bunch of creme puffs on this board.
    Everything I say is satire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by digi355 View Post
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    greaterfool.ca read 6 years worth of his posts... Long, long term, TFSA should be growth focused and diversified via a lot more than 3 stocks. If dividends are what you want buy the above ETF. Here's what mine's split betweeen - all boring ETFs that the bitcoin / option ballers will piss on...

    DXP
    FCIQ
    PDC
    VWO
    VWO
    XSP
    I'll have a look at those. Also, earlier I said we DCA over three stocks monthly, but total holdings right now is across 10 individual stocks. Worst one was buying into SNC in 2016 :/ going to have to hold on to that one for a while.

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    Quote Originally Posted by digi355 View Post
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    greaterfool.ca read 6 years worth of his posts... Long, long term, TFSA should be growth focused and diversified via a lot more than 3 stocks.
    I agree..YOLO on the TFSA.

    by the way...where did all these OG lurkers come from?
    Quote Originally Posted by 89coupe View Post
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    Beyond, bunch of creme puffs on this board.
    Everything I say is satire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by syscal View Post
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    Does that hold true over the long term though? You'd only see yield positive growth if you sold the stock after that year, no? Buying more stock month over month and Alaris might be the better choice no? (on the assumption you believe the stock will increase...)
    Selling stock to turn it into money isn't much different than dividends providing said money. The net valuation assuming a value-equal transaction is the same (IE- you sell the # of stocks needed to generate the same income as dividends).

    RE: buying more stock money over month, if you're just going to buy more stock, why wouldn't the same be true of XAW? In either case, this is tangential to my broader point as AD and XAW can't even be appropriately compared.

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    Dividend investing apparently brings all the boys to the yard.
    Quote Originally Posted by schurchill39 View Post
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    Oh god, don't get him started.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Dividend investing apparently brings all the boys to the yard.
    Beats the shit out of arguing about masks and covid.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A790 View Post
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    Beats the shit out of arguing about masks and covid.
    Accurate
    Quote Originally Posted by schurchill39 View Post
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    Oh god, don't get him started.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Accurate
    giphy.gif
    Quote Originally Posted by 89coupe View Post
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    Beyond, bunch of creme puffs on this board.
    Everything I say is satire.

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    Quote Originally Posted by syscal View Post
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    Anyway, EJ guy made sense and we've had good returns. Total fees on the stock side sit at about $230/yr without no increase unless we do more transactions, which isn't in the plans right now. At this point I would need to start researching and learning before I'd feel comfortable taking this on myself, so I'm sticking with them as he's been pretty good for us so far.

    Yea, I'm on the fence on the build-up/drip on the payments. Build-up means I don't need to save up a lump sum, so that cash goes into monthly purchases of more stock. Either way I'm saving money for the next stock.
    How many transactions are you doing a year? Canadian stock trades can be done with pretty much all brokerages in Canada for under $10 a trade. Some brokers such as Questtrade even have zero transaction fees for ETFs, which matters if you're making frequent transactions. Full service brokers/advisors such as Edward Jones tend to charge higher fees for each stock transaction. Edward Jones may not charge for transactions involving mutual funds, but they will receive trailer fees (essentially sales commissions) which will cut into your returns, on top of the MER fees (typically 1.5 to 2.5% for Canadian mutual funds, and often 1.0% or less for ETFs).

    I'm firmly of the view that Edward Jones advisors are never worth it, but I've been investing on my own for sometime now. Buy and hold is the way to go - don't ever get into daytrading - the transaction fees will kill you and it will become a time-consuming full-time job leaving you with little/no time for anything else.

    As for my own portfolio, I have many dividend payers that I've held and will continue to hold for the long term. Most are concentrated in telecom (T, BCE, RCI.B), financials (all of the big six banks) and REITs (mostly residential and industrial).

    Online brokers have come a long way over the past 5-10 years in terms of the information they provide. I use TD and HSBC for my investment accounts and you can see the purchase price (book value) and dividend payments (under activity or cash history) quite easily. Most companies post the dividend histories on their website, e.g. https://www.telus.com/en/about/inves...nd-information or https://granitereit.com/investors/distributions/

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