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Thread: Predictions for a Biden presidency - MEGA THREAD

  1. #201
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    Did kert just call down a project for not being viable without government investment?




    Thanks, I needed that.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

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    Originally posted by Toma
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    Fuck I hope line5 gets shut in and then lets hear trudeau whine once it impacts Ontario
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    Im the one with a learning disability....

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    As for Trudeau, we just renegotiated our multilateral trade agreement, seems like something to have been in the consideration if he had any intention of defending Canada’s interests. Should have been pretty easy to do considering he was negotiating with a guy who had approved the pipeline.
    Renovating the terms of KXL was conditional on Trump's first permit ahead of the USMCA negotiations in the first place, so no leverage there.

    Then shortly after USMCA was signed, the first court hurdle happened requiring more of an environmental assessment. Nothing that the executive branch could do. So it wouldn't have mattered what concessions were made, it would have been a losing deal.

    Then another permit in 2019 (that the President could cancel for any reason).

    Then, as the project was no longer considered viable by TC, Alberta gave all the taxpayer money to get the project moving in the face of court battles and protests.

    Then 16 days later another court decision blocking the project.

    Then a month after that, Biden said he'd cancel the project if elected.


    The most this project ever had going for it, was the stroke of a pen by a tempermental man baby who could have pulled it because TSN called Cabot Cliffs a nicer course than Trump Turnberry if he wanted to. Imagine being asked to give up negotiating power for that?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    Did kert just call down a project for not being viable without government investment?




    Thanks, I needed that.
    It matters less to me, but mattes a lot to the guy who said the government can't bet on businesses and invest in things that aren't viable. I forget exactly who said it, but our Premier should have taken his advice.

  4. #204
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    The story is the same here as it has been for years, we have to develop our own tide-water access for the export of our resources so we're not at mercy of the bully to the South. Why is this so hard for politicians to grasp?
    "Masked Bandit is a gateway drug for frugal spending." - Unknown303

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    Quote Originally Posted by Masked Bandit View Post
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    The story is the same here as it has been for years, we have to develop our own tide-water access for the export of our resources so we're not at mercy of the bully to the South. Why is this so hard for politicians to grasp?
    Because there is too much Saudi money flowing into their own private funds to GAF where the rest of us peons make our merger pittance...
    Bob Blakeborough

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    I personally don't blame Trudeau for KXL. I blame him for Northern Gateway and Energy East.
    Well he only approves Northern Gateway because Harper signed FIPPA with China.

    Without FIPPA, pretty sure Northern Gateway would have been cancelled too.

    And seeing how China treats Australia on their coal. I'm not even sure who the customer will be once NG is flowing. Who in the pacific rim can process our oil? And good luck trying to get a refinery going in Canada... let alone in hippie central of pacific NW.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 01-22-2021 at 03:04 PM.

  7. #207
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    Well he only approves Northern Gateway because Harper signed FIPPA with China.

    Without FIPPA, pretty sure Northern Gateway would have been cancelled too..
    Northern Gateway WAS cancelled by Trudeau.
    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    If there is one thing I know for sure. ES has no Aspen goals

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Northern Gateway WAS cancelled by Trudeau.

    Shit, I mixed up Northern Gateway to Transmountain, my bad.

    Trudeau is desperate to keep China happy. In 2016, his government began negotiating a free trade agreement with China. At the time, the Globe and Mail reported, “a senior Chinese official said this will require Canadian concessions on investment restrictions and a commitment to build an energy pipeline to the coast”.

    Less than a year later, Trudeau approved the expansion of the Trans Mountain pipeline. Talks for the free trade agreement are ongoing.
    Last edited by Xtrema; 01-22-2021 at 03:43 PM.

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    If Kenney was a Japanese warlord, this would be about the time he fell on his sword.
    Opportunity Cost : Columbus spent $0 on burned carbon fuels to find America.

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    Yes, northern gateway was the "big daddy" heavy oil export pipeline. Great project. Its disgusting that it was shut down for political reasons when its benefits to the entire country were so large and obvious.
    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    If there is one thing I know for sure. ES has no Aspen goals

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Yes, northern gateway was the "big daddy" heavy oil export pipeline. Great project. Its disgusting that it was shut down for political reasons when its benefits to the entire country were so large and obvious.
    Huh??!
    I thought Gateway was about shipping gas to like Alaska or something. Please remind me

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    Northern Gateway was an oil pipeline. Coastal Gaslink is the pipeline to kitimat for LNG.

    The one that that one band of natives doesn’t like
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by kertejud2 View Post
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    Renovating the terms of KXL was conditional on Trump's first permit ahead of the USMCA negotiations in the first place, so no leverage there.

    Then shortly after USMCA was signed, the first court hurdle happened requiring more of an environmental assessment. Nothing that the executive branch could do. So it wouldn't have mattered what concessions were made, it would have been a losing deal.

    Then another permit in 2019 (that the President could cancel for any reason).

    Then, as the project was no longer considered viable by TC, Alberta gave all the taxpayer money to get the project moving in the face of court battles and protests.

    Then 16 days later another court decision blocking the project.

    Then a month after that, Biden said he'd cancel the project if elected.


    The most this project ever had going for it, was the stroke of a pen by a tempermental man baby who could have pulled it because TSN called Cabot Cliffs a nicer course than Trump Turnberry if he wanted to. Imagine being asked to give up negotiating power for that?

    - - - Updated - - -



    It matters less to me, but mattes a lot to the guy who said the government can't bet on businesses and invest in things that aren't viable. I forget exactly who said it, but our Premier should have taken his advice.
    You always seem to be long on observations, with mixed results if I'm being overly generous.

    But when it comes to suggestions, you're a blank.

  14. #214
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    When Northern Gateway was approved there were over 170 conditions that still had to be met, 20 First Nations along the route still hadn’t been brought on board, the cost of the pipeline was increasing, lawsuits from the challengers lining up, oil prices were falling, oil sands expansion was stalling, Enbridge didn’t have plans NG on their reports aside from how it was going to be a lot more expensive because of the conditions and deals and lawsuits they had to deal with, suggesting they were trying to drop it quietly...and then the Liberals were elected.

    Trudeau basically killed a pipeline that was dead in the water anyway. But people talk about it like it was good to go.

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    Nothing like politicians killing a project that was weighed down by government politics in the first place.

    Then trying to claim the project was never going to work out so it really wasn’t governments fault.

    But hey, Government. Values. Buzzword. Kittens.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.

  16. #216
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    Am I being naive if I think there's still a chance that Trudeau may do something and the pipeline continues to happen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by shakalaka View Post
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    Am I being naive if I think there's still a chance that Trudeau may do something and the pipeline continues to happen?
    I think you're naive if you think there's anything he could do even if he wanted.

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    Opportunity Cost : Columbus spent $0 on burned carbon fuels to find America.

  19. #219
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    Wrong thread
    Quote Originally Posted by Gestalt View Post
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    Im the one with a learning disability....

  20. #220
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    Whut? Misallocation of funds is a serious problem. Ultimately if you want to be true and democratic to your people, you have to ask if they want a full tank of gas, an ounce of weed, or two slices of avocado toast (all things roughly of equivalent dollar value)

    That we live in a cold climate automatically skews our local perception to a tank of gas being important and valuable. All it means to many Californians (the people who we need to convince that its a good thing) Is an already hot vehicle in 40 degree weather, where you stick to the vinyl and bake to death if you don't have enough money to turn the airconditioning on. People in California do not turn on their vehicles to move, they turn it on for the airconditioning. And then some dick spills two tablespoons of gasoline and starts a 3 million acre wildfire. Which adds to smoke, smoke that vehicles already spew too much of, which taints a $3,000 bottle of wine - which makes it a $5 bottle of wine.

    Arguably, any car sold in California should have more money put into the air-conditioning than the combustion engine that actually moves it, based on what people find "important".

    As a reminder: Combustion engine ban California 2035 (if not earlier now that Biden is in) What Kenney probably should have been doing, instead of worrying about logistics of construction - He should have been in LA making the case that oil is better than marijuanna (which is a very hard sell to a Californian) OR at least get a feel for the room to know that its a lost cause to sink money into.

    Kenney just sent us on a mission to the moon, spent a billion but didn't even make it off the launchpad. The question I have now is: How many people employed were white males, or inotherwords was it all a scam to start with? I guess the argument now will be "At least we employed a few thousand white people for a few years".

    Primarily I blame this on self-delusion of importance. Kramer got it right "oil is tobacco".
    Last edited by ZenOps; 01-23-2021 at 07:10 AM.
    Opportunity Cost : Columbus spent $0 on burned carbon fuels to find America.

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