2021 f1

[Misterman]

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No new evidence. No further investigation. Not surprised.

Curious what they brought to the table. Might be worth some lolz.

I don't think it would matter if they brought a signed confession from Hamilton that he did it on purpose. The FIA isn't going to undermine themselves and admit they made a mistake. And really they didn't make a mistake. RBR not liking the rules, doesn't change the rules as they exist. It sucks there isn't more penalty for ruining someones race, but FIA still applied the penalty that exists correctly.

[Misterman]

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The new evidence was RBR using up a filming day, having Albon drive the RBR car on test tires at the same speed and lines as Hamilton to prove that Hamilton purposely rammed Max.

Mercedes only released a short statement that accused RBR management of tarnishing the sporting integrity of Hamilton.

Wow they went farther than I expected. My assumption was it would be Ham's telemetry data uploaded to a Sim that would show him plowing through the corner.

[Buster]

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I don't think it would matter if they brought a signed confession from Hamilton that he did it on purpose. The FIA isn't going to undermine themselves and admit they made a mistake. And really they didn't make a mistake. RBR not liking the rules, doesn't change the rules as they exist. It sucks there isn't more penalty for ruining someones race, but FIA still applied the penalty that exists correctly.

FIA needs to rethink things when you can gain a significant net benefit by skillfully punting your world championship rival off the track in on of the most dangerous parts of the entire F1 season.

Other sports would call it "targetting" or "intent to injure"

[tonytiger55]

In some respects. I think the FIA and along with the owners are managing this as it may be good for the sport in terms of revenue.
I mean we are all going to be watching the next few races now. The bitchfest has made the championship more exciting.

[shakalaka]

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FIA needs to rethink things when you can gain a significant net benefit by skillfully punting your world championship rival off the track in on of the most dangerous parts of the entire F1 season.

Other sports would call it "targetting" or "intent to injure"

So the penalty should be higher because the championship rival got pushed into a wall? So should it be less severe if someone not in the running ends up in the wall? What if two people neither of whom are championship contenders do this with each other? Does that matter?

This sort of arbitrary distinction is impossible to implement. It doesn't matter who went into the wall and what the other person gained from it. People are just so bent over it because it was Max who went into the wall and Ham ended up winning. If Ham hadn't won after the 10 second penalty I guarantee no one would have been complaining.

Bottom line is FIA rules that Ham was 'predominantly' at fault, i.e., Max wasn't faultless. His fans can whine and cry over it all they want and call FIA names, ultimately it isn't going to change what actually happened. Anyway, I am looking forward to Hungary and hoping for another exciting session. Ham and Max at the front is going to be super fun and let whoever is having a better day on that day win.
@rage2 we should set up a conference thing that you do. I will be watching on the big screen on my end, but still cool to have a 'watch party'. I just hate how it has to be at fucking 7AM our time...

[bjstare]

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So the penalty should be higher because the championship rival got pushed into a wall? So should it be less severe if someone not in the running ends up in the wall? What if two people neither of whom are championship contenders do this with each other? Does that matter?

This sort of arbitrary distinction is impossible to implement. It doesn't matter who went into the wall and what the other person gained from it. People are just so bent over it because it was Max who went into the wall and Ham ended up winning. If Ham hadn't won after the 10 second penalty I guarantee no one would have been complaining.

Bottom line is FIA rules that Ham was 'predominantly' at fault, i.e., Max wasn't faultless.

Tell me you're a lawyer, without telling me you're a lawyer.

[rage2]

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I find it funny when people try to say RBR are whiners. When we all know that if roles reversed and Max had driven Lewis off the track, Toto would be making as much or more noise as Horner is. It's F1, you take any edge you can get, both on and off the track.

I spent some time last night trying to find a similar situation. Since Mercedes have been mostly dominating, it was sure tough to find, but I did find something in 2018 when Ferrari was the stronger car. This was after 2 races were Ferrari took out a Mercedes in a racing incident that impacted the championship at that stage. They felt 2 incidents over 2 races was suspect. You’re right, Mercedes did do something similar, insinuating that it was intentional.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...rrari-mercedes

The difference was, they apologized and said they were wrong the next day. Heat of the moment comments.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...ish-grand-prix

Still waiting on rbr to say more than “nothing personal” lol.

[rage2]

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@rage2 we should set up a conference thing that you do. I will be watching on the big screen on my end, but still cool to have a 'watch party'. I just hate how it has to be at fucking 7AM our time...

I have a zoom watch party with F1 fans in India. You should join, fit right in haha.

[Buster]

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So the penalty should be higher because the championship rival got pushed into a wall? So should it be less severe if someone not in the running ends up in the wall? What if two people neither of whom are championship contenders do this with each other? Does that matter?

This sort of arbitrary distinction is impossible to implement. It doesn't matter who went into the wall and what the other person gained from it. People are just so bent over it because it was Max who went into the wall and Ham ended up winning. If Ham hadn't won after the 10 second penalty I guarantee no one would have been complaining.

Bottom line is FIA rules that Ham was 'predominantly' at fault, i.e., Max wasn't faultless. His fans can whine and cry over it all they want and call FIA names, ultimately it isn't going to change what actually happened. Anyway, I am looking forward to Hungary and hoping for another exciting session. Ham and Max at the front is going to be super fun and let whoever is having a better day on that day win.
@rage2 we should set up a conference thing that you do. I will be watching on the big screen on my end, but still cool to have a 'watch party'. I just hate how it has to be at fucking 7AM our time...

There isn't a sport on the planet that allows you to retain the benefit of an action that leads to a penalty.

[rage2]

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There isn't a sport on the planet that allows you to retain the benefit of an action that leads to a penalty.

How about hockey, get a penalty for injuring top player taking them out of the game, team gets a power play. Then the penalized team scores a short handed goal because the top player isn’t there.

[sexualbanana]

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How about hockey, get a penalty for injuring top player taking them out of the game, team gets a power play. Then the penalized team scores a short handed goal because the top player isn’t there.

Didn't the Flames tell Iggy to fight less because the tradeoff between him sitting in the box versus the 4th liner he just fought was totally off-kilter?

[rage2]

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Didn't the Flames tell Iggy to fight less because the tradeoff between him sitting in the box versus the 4th liner he just fought was totally off-kilter?

Yup. That would be equivalent to telling Max to leave more room in corner battles when you’re leading the championship by over a race win.

[killramos]

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There isn't a sport on the planet that allows you to retain the benefit of an action that leads to a penalty.

You’re right. Hamilton shouldn’t have been penalized at all.

Max on the other hand…

[Buster]

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How about hockey, get a penalty for injuring top player taking them out of the game, team gets a power play. Then the penalized team scores a short handed goal because the top player isn’t there.

More like running the goalie and letting the goal stand.

[killramos]

More like the goalie skating out of the net to try and check the shooter, and breaking his leg in the process.

[Buster]

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More like the goalie skating out of the net to try and check the shooter, and breaking his leg in the process.

staaaahp

[rage2]

Yea, this is way more entertaining than the actual drama haha.

[flipstah]

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More like the goalie skating out of the net to try and check the shooter, and breaking his leg in the process.

I see we’re playing Tonya Harding Hockey

[Misterman]

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I spent some time last night trying to find a similar situation. Since Mercedes have been mostly dominating, it was sure tough to find, but I did find something in 2018 when Ferrari was the stronger car. This was after 2 races were Ferrari took out a Mercedes in a racing incident that impacted the championship at that stage. They felt 2 incidents over 2 races was suspect. You’re right, Mercedes did do something similar, insinuating that it was intentional.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...rrari-mercedes

The difference was, they apologized and said they were wrong the next day. Heat of the moment comments.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/20...ish-grand-prix

Still waiting on rbr to say more than “nothing personal” lol.

Personally I wouldn't see saving face with the FIA after they shut you down as being a distinctive factor here. But that's just me. You can call them whiners or bitches, but at the end of the day it is millions of dollars on the line, so like I said, you take any advantage you can get. They're just doing their jobs.

[davidI]

Technology is sweet. Managed to watch qualifying in a hammock in Georgia 12km from the Russian border with a VPN and LTE.

Not happy with what happened to Sainz in Q2 or Vettel in P10 or Hamilton being on pole after the last race but happy I could catch it live anyway...