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Thread: Has your politics changed drastically in the last 15 years, why?

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antonito View Post
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    This is pretty much what happened to me as well. I started out my 20s thinking that because I had come from a "poor" home and moved out on my own at 18 so everyone should just stop whining and get a job. Meeting a lot of people who worked their way out from actual crushing poverty made me realize that there's worse things than having hand made clothes and shopping at Value Village, and that with the types of obstacles there are it's ridiculous to think saying "get a job" is going to be the solution. Yes people can make it out, but it's statistically and realistically unlikely.
    I used to have the mentality of "If I can, why can't you" and the world is black and white in the 20s. Then part of growing up is you starts to experience the world thru other people's eyes and realize that it's a lot less straight forward than that.

    What I really worry is that we are about to deal with a generation of kids who grew up on "good and evil" ideology from Disney and other media and cancel culture is probably the result. Bad people do good things, and nobody is an angel 100% of the time. And people should at least cut people some slack and reasonable doubt.

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    I don't think my political leanings have changed per se, by rather my view of the political system and government in general. The older I get the less confidence I have in any government. I don't think Ottawa is any more competent than my local neighbourhood community association. The people involved at every level are little more than busy-bodies that want to have control over something. These are the same people that ran for student council in high school and thought it meant something. It doesn't. Where it all went pear shaped for me was when I started seeing people I actually knew get elected to public office. One of them federal, several provincial and in every case they were solid C students who were just concerned with being popular. None of these folks were of any substance, it was all just a show. Kind of like having a substitute drama teacher / snowboard instructor at the front of the parade.

    The reality is that there is no master plan, there is no geniuses standing at the wheel...it's every many for himself.
    Last edited by Masked Bandit; 02-28-2021 at 08:46 AM.
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  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    What I really worry is that we are about to deal with a generation of kids who grew up on "good and evil" ideology from Disney and other media and cancel culture is probably the result. Bad people do good things, and nobody is an angel 100% of the time. And people should at least cut people some slack and reasonable doubt.
    This is probably my biggest gripe with the current state of politics, and both sides of the fence are absolutely 100% guilty of this line of thinking. They're politicians, not some disney villain or hero. They aren't scheming behind closed doors to destroy your life, they are scheming behind closed doors to get re elected and keep their jobs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sentry View Post
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    This is probably my biggest gripe with the current state of politics, and both sides of the fence are absolutely 100% guilty of this line of thinking. They're politicians, not some disney villain or hero. They aren't scheming behind closed doors to destroy your life, they are scheming behind closed doors to get re elected and keep their jobs.
    They might not be actively scheming to ruin your life, but their active scheming to enrich their own lives, IS at a direct cost to your life even if you consider that end result to be passive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Misterman View Post
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    Generally people drift right over time. Which makes perfect sense. It seems like a great idea when you're young to provide for everyone, hippy love and all that shit. Then the more you start paying in taxes as you advance in your career over time and make more money, you start to want accountability of where that money is going. And you start to realize that providing for everyone is actually a ponzi scheme that is not sustainable. Then it becomes about what part of the spectrum you land on to find the balance of financial accountability and social welfare, and it's different for everyone.

    The weird thing is that we all essentially talk like there is just left and right, when in reality most sensible people will identify as Libertarian whether they realize it or not. Most of us tend to think people should do what makes them happy, and that the government should be accountable to their spending. People that identify as conservative or right wing, generally only do so because they value fiscal conservatism. It's only the fringe extremes that want the government regulating abortion and sexuality, like some bible thumping hand of god.
    This post has a lot of forgone conclusions trying to be established. While Trudeau is a federal example of poor management, your own premiere is a conservative example of the same or worse. It's easy to be a genius when the economy is in good shape and demand for oil is off the charts. While it's lazy to believe that Alberta's oil boom was due to what people believe was the PC's welcoming economic policy, the outcome of it is where we are now; energy companies leaving Alberta, brain drain, talk of PST, lowered value for our tax dollar, and a brutal increase in low IQ extremism.

    People are mad at Biden over the pipeline, sure, but his position on it was known well in advance of the election. How much did Alberta and is companies through into that program without hedging their position? Conservatism (Edit: in terms of party politics) is not inherently fiscally responsible. Financial accountability and social welfare are not mutually exclusive. The trio I look for is governmental competency, transparency in policy making, and a tendency towards benefitting the majority of people (and not via dinosaur-aged trickle-down theory).

    Can I get your opinion on corporate welfare now?
    Last edited by CUG; 02-22-2021 at 03:34 PM.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Antonito View Post
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    This is pretty much what happened to me as well. I started out my 20s thinking that because I had come from a "poor" home and moved out on my own at 18 so everyone should just stop whining and get a job. Meeting a lot of people who worked their way out from actual crushing poverty made me realize that there's worse things than having hand made clothes and shopping at Value Village, and that with the types of obstacles there are it's ridiculous to think saying "get a job" is going to be the solution. Yes people can make it out, but it's statistically and realistically unlikely.

    Lately though I've started becoming pretty hopeless about the whole thing. I can't see a way to get money out of politics, but I also can't see how leaving everything up to corporations would be better. Also that everything on both sides is so half assed. If you want to get away from oil production, you'd better have a Plan B, not just vague words about diversification of the economy. Or if you're going to go all in on oil production, you'd better have a viable plan to get this shit to market. As it is now we're just floating in the middle of the river without a paddle.

    Cancel culture bothers me because it's a small symptom of a much bigger problem: we as a species have no idea how to handle this level of connectivity.
    Yep, I thought we weren't "well off" because my family didn't buy an insanely large home with a hot tub like all the cool kids had in Signal Hill or whatever. My family lived well within their means, largely due to the influence of wartime economics my grandparents went through - passed on to my parents etc. Imagine being shamed for growing up well-fed, clothed, with a roof over your head, full access to healthcare and education, and an abundance of opportunity just because your family didn't take out a mortgage as big as someone else.

    I share that hopeless sentiment as well. For me it's any time I see a really confident antivaxxer pumping out nonsense, and no amount of expertise and evidence will get them to stop. That scales up to people's political beliefs as well (What is wrong with Kansas talks about this phenomenon). Good seeing you again man.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUG View Post
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    This post has a lot of forgone conclusions trying to be established. While Trudeau is a federal example of poor management, your own premiere is a conservative example of the same or worse. It's easy to be a genius when the economy is in good shape and demand for oil is off the charts. While it's lazy to believe that Alberta's oil boom was due to what people believe was the PC's welcoming economic policy, the outcome of it is where we are now; energy companies leaving Alberta, brain drain, talk of PST, lowered value for our tax dollar, and a brutal increase in low IQ extremism.

    People are mad at Biden over the pipeline, sure, but his position on it was known well in advance of the election. How much did Alberta and is companies through into that program without hedging their position? Conservatism is not inherently fiscally responsible. Financial accountability and social welfare are not mutually exclusive. The trio I look for is governmental competency, transparency in policy making, and a tendency towards benefitting the majority of people (and not via dinosaur-aged trickle-down theory).

    Can I get your opinion on corporate welfare now?
    I don't know what you're getting at? Sounds like you made a lot of forgone conclusions about my post.

    I certainly never claimed Conservatives were some kind of pinnacle of fiscal responsibility. However, they are most definitely the lesser of two evils if you want to just compare Liberal vs. Conservative. If you want to use anecdotes in regards to current governments to make some kind of point about Conservatives being poor money managers, then look no further than the current federal regime, which you already seem to understand are inept. You'll have to restructure your argument at that point. Not sure why you call JK MY Premier? I am Albertan, so of course he is my Premier, just as much as he is yours.

    This discussion highlights why I'm not happy about the current state of politics. The left continues to go ever left and cater to a minority of people that they believe to be a majority, and buy as many votes as possible. And the right just follows left so as not to lose voters in the middle who might lean a little left.

    I've never seen a government be very competent, transparent, or lean towards benefitting the majority of people. And nobody seems very apt to elect one, as is demonstrated by the Libertarian party performance in elections.

    Corporate welfare? What sort of opinion are you looking for? It can be done in a multitude of ways, some effective, some not. The ways that are effective, are more beneficial than virtually all social welfare. However, I'm not really down with any crony capitalism. The government should stay the hell out of business, except for regulating it to look after the rights of the individual and prevent the little guy from getting stomped on.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misterman View Post
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    I don't know what you're getting at? Sounds like you made a lot of forgone conclusions about my post.
    Oh, the old tried and true "no you". Good chat.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUG View Post
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    Oh, the old tried and true "no you". Good chat.
    Good call. Best to just ignore everything and bow out when you get in over your head.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misterman View Post
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    Good call. Best to just ignore everything and bow out when you get in over your head.
    The irony of your statement is that it's almost entirely true except for the last part. The fact I've deconstructed the mechanics of your family-brand low quality arguments so easily means everybody should ignore you. Don't know what else to tell you, Julian.

    If you're actually interested in not being the dumbest person in your circles, U of C, MRU et al offer open studies courses that have introductory science and statistics classes. It often gets labelled "liberal brainwashing" by your high BMI gang family members, but it will inform you on the framework of how a lot of the things that enable you to exist came to be. And because I know people like you need to be told, you're supposed to wash your asshole in the shower.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

  11. #31
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    You sure have a high opinion of yourself, donít you.

    You really have the whole ad hominem thing down pat.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

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    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUG View Post
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    The irony of your statement is that it's almost entirely true except for the last part. The fact I've deconstructed the mechanics of your family-brand low quality arguments so easily means everybody should ignore you. Don't know what else to tell you, Julian.

    If you're actually interested in not being the dumbest person in your circles, U of C, MRU et al offer open studies courses that have introductory science and statistics classes. It often gets labelled "liberal brainwashing" by your high BMI gang family members, but it will inform you on the framework of how a lot of the things that enable you to exist came to be. And because I know people like you need to be told, you're supposed to wash your asshole in the shower.
    I know you've been away for a while, but there's a super handy "ignore user" feature on the forums these days.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tik-Tok View Post
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    I'd be lying if I said I didn't disagree.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    You sure have a high opinion of yourself, don’t you.

    You really have the whole ad hominem thing down pat.
    Yes to both.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by CUG View Post
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    The irony of your statement is that it's almost entirely true except for the last part. The fact I've deconstructed the mechanics of your family-brand low quality arguments so easily means everybody should ignore you. Don't know what else to tell you, Julian.

    If you're actually interested in not being the dumbest person in your circles, U of C, MRU et al offer open studies courses that have introductory science and statistics classes. It often gets labelled "liberal brainwashing" by your high BMI gang family members, but it will inform you on the framework of how a lot of the things that enable you to exist came to be. And because I know people like you need to be told, you're supposed to wash your asshole in the shower.
    Ah yes, the rock solid argument deconstructor known as "Oh yeah, well fuck you" Must have learned that one in your introductory science and statistics classes. You've most certainly owned me good sir.

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    I would like to see mass anarchy. Three days without water will kill off billions. Then let the small fiefdoms arise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by suntan View Post
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    I would like to see mass anarchy. Three days without water will kill off billions. Then let the small fiefdoms arise.
    So Texas?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrema View Post
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    So Texas?
    Nah it's gotta be on a continental level.

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    i guess i became more jaded in that no matter who is in charged nothing really changes and we get false promises and screwed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by austic View Post
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    i guess i became more jaded in that no matter who is in charged nothing really changes and we get false promises and screwed.
    The number of people on Twitter surprised about all the campaign promises Biden has been breaking is hilarious.

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    Quote Originally Posted by suntan View Post
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    The number of people on Twitter surprised about all the campaign promises Biden has been breaking is hilarious.
    Vote Democrat. Get Cash.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.

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