215 bodies in Kamloops mass childrens grave.

[Buster]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

https://globalnews.ca/news/7983419/2...-first-nation/

That's great isn't it?

Any other country, and it would be called "ethnic tension".

[lilmira]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Any other country, and it would be called "ethnic tension".

peaceful protest?

[Buster]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

peaceful protest?

"dividing people by race works great!"

-kert

[kertejud2]

"Only good Indian is a dead Indian"

-Buster


If we're just gonna make shit up.

[gwill]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Until someone goes over there and starts digging, no one knows for sure what those scans really are. Even then, who gives a fuck, whats going to change? Nothing. Finding mass or unmarked graves won't improve the lives of natives in this country and if anything it will just cause more hatred. What do they want, an apology, more money? What's anything going to do. Nothing. No one really wants real change.

My parents came to Canada with absolutely nothing besides the clothes on their backs and a suitcase, just like many other European immigrants. We would've killed to have just half the privilege the FN get. The indian act, reserves and special status they receive based on race is the real delusional and psychotic thing about this. No one in this country has the political balls to treat natives like normal people, without the race-based status cards and race-based indian reserves. Until there is a want for change, on both sides, FN will always be the palestinians of Canada.

who the fuck gives a shit about your parents or anything they did. How do you twist a post about dead children in unmarked Graves about your parents?

Remember that 3rd party investigation you said you wanted?? Those companies/people are the ones providing providing reports your not wanting to believe.

[Buster]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

"Only good Indian is a dead Indian"

-Buster


If we're just gonna make shit up.

When have I ever suggested killing anyone?

[Buster]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

who the fuck gives a shit about your parents.

Actually in Canada you must pay for the sins of your ancestors.

Furthermore in Canada you're responsible for the sins of other peoples' ancestors... So long as those ancestors do not belong to a certain select group of "innocent" ancestors.

[Misterman]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The guy wants an independent verification on things. That's what's been happening with the scans... he then jumped to denying the scans show anything. Where are the responsible questions?

Is denying the science behind the 3rd party investigation responsible? I'd say it's borderline delusional.

Well to be fair you're being extremely ignorant, as you don't know shit about fuck in regards to the scans yourself. You're wildly unobjective in this subject, and your emotional bias is clouding your judgement. But we know this, it's par for the course for you.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm always impressed by people's commitment to the strategy of if we ignore it long enough, maybe it'll all go away. It hasn't worked yet.

Some of the people who are responsible for this are still alive. It's not me, and it's not you. Finding them guilty doesn't make us guilty. There's no better time than now to go after them.

We will never know unless we start ignoring it and treating these people like equals. We should definitely give the strategy a go, it does happen to align with all of known psychology. Up till now Canada has been placating natives for decades, which makes the situation worse.

But I'm all for holding the church accountable for their BS.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

"Only good Indian is a dead Indian"

-Buster


If we're just gonna make shit up.

There's no "we". He made a pretty reflective sum of your statements to date on this matter.

[SKR]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

We will never know unless we start ignoring it and treating these people like equals.

One step of that strategy might be to quit acting like there's nothing that can be done about things that happened in the past, especially in the recent enough past that victims and perpetrators are still alive. The fear among white people is that we're all going to be held responsible for things that happened before we were born, but boys, the people who are responsible for it are right here. We don't have to be their proxy if they're here right now. I can't believe we have to examine how much there is to lose by investigating dead children before we make a move, but if there's a cost this is as low as it's going to get.

Like I said before, if this was 750 missing persons cases there'd be riots. But because it's 750 dead Indians, people want to just ignore it and hope that it goes away. That's not treating them as equals.

[killramos]

Out of curiosity. What exactly is there to be be done about this? Aside from the usual throw money at it song and dance.

Who exactly are these people “right here right now” you are proposing going after?

How many 10’s of millions do we need to piss away before the cost isn’t “as low as it is going to get”.

750 missing persons cases over 150 years, likely heavily front weighted. Context is important.

[suntan]

I think the goal is to keep the money perpetually coming.

[2020]

Yep, they won’t ever be happy. Tragic yes but there is human atrocities in all of people kinds history, we got to move on folks.

[jutes]

Lets give money to the Jews every time a mass grave is found in Eastern Europe and offer apologies and call for reconciliation. They more or less moved on and have their own country, what do the indians in Canada have besides run-down reserves and no drinking water?

[speedog]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Yep, they won’t ever be happy. Tragic yes but there is human atrocities in all of people kinds history, we got to move on folks.

Don't comment here very often any more but let me put this into context for you - I am old enough to have been alive during the latter parts of the existence and operation of some of these residential schools and some of the indigenous people I have befriended over the years may very well have attended a residential school and experienced first hand some of the horrors being described or know of friends or family that never returned from their residential school stays.

So per your statement, I should just sweep under the rug their pain and memories, not acknowledge their suffering nor bring to justice some of those that may very well still be alive and were actually involved in some of the atrocities that are coming to light?

Sorry but I can't do that, my indigenous friends deserve more than to have us just move on - some of them may very well have brothers or sisters or friends buried in unmarked graves and they, themselves, could very well borne both physical and other scars from their residential school stays.

I can't speak to what my friends expect as retribution but I suspect simple apologies by the parties involved would go a long ways and we all need to remember that this is just not the Catholic church - other church organizations were just as involved in the residential school system, they all need to step up and acknowledge the improper treatment they doled out to Canada's indigenous peoples.

The last residential school that was operated by a church had it's operation wrested from the church in 1969, the last residential school operated by the government of Canada was shuttered in 1996 - I've been around long enough to have seen both dates in my life time, have you 2020?

I'll go away once again, best for me and this forum.

[SKR]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Out of curiosity. What exactly is there to be be done about this? Aside from the usual throw money at it song and dance.

Who exactly are these people “right here right now” you are proposing going after?

How many 10’s of millions do we need to piss away before the cost isn’t “as low as it is going to get”.

750 missing persons cases over 150 years, likely heavily front weighted. Context is important.

Am I really the only one that thinks it's worth looking into criminal charges for people who had children die under their care? I want to know if people who were running the schools belong in jail for this, and if they do, get as many as we can while we still can.

I'm not advocating for cutting FN a check.

Edit:

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Lets give money to the Jews every time a mass grave is found in Eastern Europe and offer apologies and call for reconciliation. They more or less moved on and have their own country, what do the indians in Canada have besides run-down reserves and no drinking water?

If we find people who were running the camps, they're put on trial. That's what I want.

[msommers]

Lots of talk about money being what people are after, and I'm looking at this differently. Honestly, I think FN communities just want recognition that horrible things happened and that residential schools greatly affected FN progression. Having the church and government recognizing the issue and actually having a discussion on how to move passed it -- lots of FN leaders have stated that money isn't the solution and actually is hindering progress. I just cannot genuinely fathom that some FNs went out of their way to find these graves solely for the purpose of financial gain.

I know someone who was part of the 60s scoop. For them just having the government and church admit their major fuck up would be a huge burden lifted. But avoidance and denial are strong in our country, it's even obvious on this board that some think residential schools weren't that bad, they had good intentions, that people should stop complaining, that a history of addictions is because of endless handouts. The reality is most Canadians have never had a direct conversation with someone about it from FN communities -- I have and it's countless heartbreaking stories of destroyed families.

Money isn't the solution here, nor do I believe it is FN's aim here.

[killramos]

Right, that’s fine. So who are these people you want to lock up? And I assume you have enough evidence to convict them in a court of law?

I assume you realize that the people who oversaw these schools during the years that the overwhelming majority of these deaths happened kicked off decades ago right? And that the overwhelming majority of those deaths wouldn’t meet any kind of legal standard for a criminal conviction even if the evidence was available.

Basically. What’s the end goal here?

[ZenOps]

Truth. If I could go back in time to see Jeebus turn water into wine, I'd like a chemical analysis to see if it was simply the OXI-clean purple to clear (or in this case, clear to purple) laundry hack.



I'm also incredibly curious to know if Trump was actually net positive in assets before he became prez. Both of those may remain secrets forever.

There is also a fundamental difference in priority for most religions: Faith has much higher weight than truth. Whereas the agnostics tend to weigh truth as higher importance than faith. Faith is fine and can be an awesome thing if no-one ends up in a mass grave, but no doubt can end up that way.

Its especially bad for faith based politicians, truth is so far down on the list - that they literally only fess up to their crimes when they are on their deathbeds "as a brag".

[SKR]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Right, that’s fine. So who are these people you want to lock up?

I said who.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

And I assume you have enough evidence to convict them in a court of law?

Luckily it's not SKR's job to produce evidence for every criminal trial in the country. SKR wouldn't need evidence if he was a judge. SKR would be a police state.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I assume you realize that the people who oversaw these schools during the years that the overwhelming majority of these deaths happened kicked off decades ago right?

So not all of them, then. Some people who are responsible for the schools might still be alive.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

And that the overwhelming majority of those deaths wouldn’t meet any kind of legal standard for a criminal conviction even if the evidence was available.

So not all of them, then. Some deaths might be criminal.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Basically. What’s the end goal here?

The answer is right there in your own words. Some of the people who are still alive might be criminally responsible for some of the deaths. I don't think it's worth the trouble to put John A MacDonald on trial. I do think it's worth putting Father Jerkoff on trial if he's still around.

Canada's plan for FN is this:



This strategy isn't working.

[killramos]

So your plan is yell at some clouds, and throw countless resources at investigating a problem that is well known, to in all likelihood end up at the same place we are today.

Investigating 30+ year old cold cases is about as terrible of a societal ROI as it gets.