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Thread: European Energy Crisis, Foreshadowing for the rest of the world?

  1. #21
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    EURCAD is 1.46, and the initial graph is based on generation rates, not retail rates so yeah - its literally at least 10x more expensive than Canada. So far.
    Lake mead tier 2a shortage. 12 generator shutdown at Hoover Dam.

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    Quote Originally Posted by haggis88 View Post
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    Yes, thanks...idk where i got snowball from
    https://www.urbandictionary.com/defi...erm=snowballed

    @haggis88 I dunno man... You need to talk to Freud.

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    I already watched this show… love when life imitates art!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Buster View Post
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    Can you put some context on how these prices compare?
    Here's a easy chart showing electricity prices in Texas and Alberta. you do have three currencies to deal with, but gives you a good clear idea anyway.
    In Europe it's over 300 Euros/MWH. In Texas it's ~$50USD/MWH and in Alberta is $90CAD/MWH
    Ercot Electrciity Price.PNG


    EDIT MARTH>
    Last edited by ExtraSlow; 12-21-2021 at 04:44 PM.
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    I almost shat myself after eating way too much at lunch with @killramos so ya, we can start the diaper thread now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    Here's a easy chart showing electricity prices in Texas and Alberta. you do have three currencies to deal with, but gives you a good clear idea anyway.
    In Europe it's over 300 Euros/MWH. In Texas it's ~$50USD/MWH and in Alberta is $90CAD/MWH
    103512[/ATTACH]


    EDIT MARTH>
    Can you convert this to the quantity of Royale’s with cheese one could buy in each country per MWh?

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    Surely this will spur solar panels everywhere all over Europe by tomorrow.

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    You can watch BBC question time over the past few years and see why. Opposition parties would just screen green. Then when any attempt at trying to solve a energy problem came about, the opposition would bicker & dither. What they don't realise is that Europe has no real natural resources. Yet the media would constantly portray Russia as bad. I think there was a time when the EU tried to bring Russia into working with the European Union. Yet the policy changed to being one that antagonises and then you got the US doing their own big anti Russia thing.
    Yet people in Europe don't realise that their gas is from Russia. When you put all these solar panels and wind farms up. What happens in the evening when you come home from work? Turn on the Sun for more power? What happens if there is no wind?
    This problem lands squarely on the green parties who flat out refused to view this as a engineering problem. Yet I am bamboozled living in Calgary where we have so much natural resources here, seeing so much opposition to oil and gas by people who drive pickup trucks and eat organic food imported on a supply chain that is carbon based.

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    It's easy math. The world is comprised of more Dumbfucks than Smartasses. Humanity has transitioned past the point where Dumbfuckery outweighs Smartassery, and Dumbassery is accelerating due to its own gravity. Smartasses (being capable of doing the math) recognize the amount of effort to mobilize & counteract this Dumbassery, yet pour their productivity into companies/industries/provinces/states/countries under the direction of Dumbasses. This is a no win scenario.

    Although I will admit during this time of year I enjoy televised bloodsport called "2 Dumbfucks vs NYC renovation project organized by child". Holiday salutations per Johnathan McClane to all!

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    Quote Originally Posted by ZenOps View Post
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    EURCAD is 1.46, and the initial graph is based on generation rates, not retail rates so yeah - its literally at least 10x more expensive than Canada. So far.
    Is it though?

    Here's my last bill in Spain for 32 days ending Dec. 13 - granted we try to be responsible with our consumption. Averages 1.08€/day or C$1.58/day.

    Note that this is for 43% renewable, 4% high efficiency co-gen, 7.4% co-gen, 20% fossil fuel (18%NG/2% coal), and 23% nuclear with the remaining sliver "others".

    Maybe someone can compare it to their Alberta bill.

    Screenshot 2021-12-22 131437.jpg

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    Depends if you have an electric car and a full circuit board running cryptomining 24/7. In which case you might also be running airconditioning in January, haha. But the flat fees are bad in Alberta for sure. BC is actually cheaper if you use less kilowatts. McMansion with a 400 amp panel epitomizes Calgary living.

    No doubt a large group of electric companies in Europe will have to declare bankruptcy this winter. Noone will beat a theoretical TsangPo dam though. Should be under 1 cent per kwh. If you measure by that rationale, Canada is expensive for power generation.

    That being said: I do plan on trying to use the 45 watt steam deck as my main (email, shitposting, etc) computer next year, which will hopefully reverse global warming.
    Last edited by ZenOps; 12-22-2021 at 08:10 AM.
    Lake mead tier 2a shortage. 12 generator shutdown at Hoover Dam.

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    I don't speak Spanish, but I am happy to see time-based pricing on that bill. makes a ton of sense that certain hours of the day cost more, and some cost less. It's a step we MUST get to in north america, because we will never be able to build the grids to handle peak loads otherwise.
    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    I almost shat myself after eating way too much at lunch with @killramos so ya, we can start the diaper thread now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    I don't speak Spanish, but I am happy to see time-based pricing on that bill. makes a ton of sense that certain hours of the day cost more, and some cost less. It's a step we MUST get to in north america, because we will never be able to build the grids to handle peak loads otherwise.
    Yea, I think there's been a law in place for many years about the requirement for smart meters and I believe all households now have them in Spain.

    They recently updated the price structure of electricity so that there are 3 different price periods. Here's a quick translation from the website:

    The 2.0TD tariff periods are defined according to the day of the week, the time of day and by geographical areas of residence which make up the power schedule (Peak and Off-peak) and energy billing periods (Peak, Intermediate and Off-peak). The Peak power period consists of Peak and Intermediate energy periods, while the Off-peak rate is the cheapest period and coincides with both terms.
    So basically, pricing is based on the different loads throughout the day which makes a lot of sense to help flatten the duck curve of consumption.

    The plan we're on has 8 hours that we selected as "promotion hours" and the other 16 hours are "non-promotion hours". We schedule our laundry, dishwasher, and some cooking (e.g. oven) for the promotion hours and when you look at our bill, it's true that we use more power during the 8 hour promotion period than during the 16 hour non-promo period.

    It makes a lot of sense and would do a lot more for GHG in Canada than these f'n EV credits the government loves to hand-out (which I'm convinced is their indirect way of infusing cash into the auto-sector/unions/voters in Onterrible).

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    I don't speak Spanish, but I am happy to see time-based pricing on that bill. makes a ton of sense that certain hours of the day cost more, and some cost less. It's a step we MUST get to in north america, because we will never be able to build the grids to handle peak loads otherwise.
    Did Ontario roll that back? Use to be a thing out there?

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    Quote Originally Posted by ExtraSlow View Post
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    I don't speak Spanish, but I am happy to see time-based pricing on that bill. makes a ton of sense that certain hours of the day cost more, and some cost less. It's a step we MUST get to in north america, because we will never be able to build the grids to handle peak loads otherwise.
    As if anyone is going to change their habits.

    All you are proposing is cost increases.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yolobimmer View Post
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    People could quickly learn to use the dryer, dishwasher, and charge their cars only overnight if there was a financial incentive.

    Overall, cost increases ARE coming. It's inevitable regardless of government policy. Some policies will mean higher increases, but we'll be paying a shitton more either way. May as well attempt to move discretionary useage to off-peak hours.
    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    I almost shat myself after eating way too much at lunch with @killramos so ya, we can start the diaper thread now.

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    isn't overnight the peak energy time? Especially with EV charging?
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yolobimmer View Post
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    isn't overnight the peak energy time? Especially with EV charging?
    That's a good point, I don't know anymore. peak used to be like 4-8pm, but I don't have any recent data. I'll bet AESO knows. That member who works for Altalink also would know.
    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    I almost shat myself after eating way too much at lunch with @killramos so ya, we can start the diaper thread now.

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    I wonder if our usage isn’t nearly as lumpy as you think it is? You need pretty significant peaks and valleys to justify the expense of tracking pricing by hour.
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

    If you think I have been trying to present myself as intellectually superior, then you truly are a dimwit.
    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yolobimmer View Post
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    isn't overnight the peak energy time? Especially with EV charging?
    Evening is peak, late night / early morning is the low. Though Alberta is less peaky than other provinces because a lot of our electricity demand is industrial and constant. So as an example you could fill your dishwasher or washer and set the timer so it starts at 5am or whatever so it finishes just as you wake up . Same with EV charging, it charges from 2am to 6am when demand is lowest.
    Nolan

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    Quote Originally Posted by killramos View Post
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    I wonder if our usage isn’t nearly as lumpy as you think it is? You need pretty significant peaks and valleys to justify the expense of tracking pricing by hour.
    I just remember growing up we were bombarded with advertisements about reducing our usage during the "electricity rush hour" so like a good little kid, I took that as truth.
    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    I almost shat myself after eating way too much at lunch with @killramos so ya, we can start the diaper thread now.

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