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  1. #1101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misterman View Post
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    It's still mind blowing that the entire point of the super license, is to prevent people buying their way in, but the guy with the license is the one paying for his seat, while the talented guy sits on the back burner.
    You can pay your way to a pretty good team in F2 to get decent results. Its well documented. It's actually much harder to do well in Indycar.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JordanEG6 View Post
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    Didn't Latifi lead the F2 championship for awhile? Or was sitting in the top 3?
    yes, then he finished 5th, 9th, 2nd in his 3 years in F2. Which is more than enough points to get his superlicense

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    Quote Originally Posted by JordanEG6 View Post
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    Didn't Latifi lead the F2 championship for awhile? Or was sitting in the top 3?
    I believe he was second in f2 but has gotten crushed by his team mates in f1.

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    My favourite thing about this super license debacle is how many points are given to WEC Hypercar series. 1st place gets 30 points then 24, 20, and 16 points for fourth. And guess how many entries there were for 2022? Just four cars. Quite literally last place gets you 16 SL points in a closed wheel racing championship. That is more points than getting 4th in Indy car.

    And to be fair some of the races did have more than 4 cars, since Perguet joined in round 4 with two cars and Glickenhaus pulled their one car out out after 4 rounds. But that one round did feature SIX cars! Pretty crazy. Also silly since drivers get full points despite 3 of them sharing the car through the event. Two strong drivers could carry a weaker third.

    Definitely a fair system.
    Last edited by pheoxs; 09-24-2022 at 12:37 PM.
    Nolan

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    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    My favourite thing about this super license debacle is how many points are given to WEC Hypercar series. 1st place gets 30 points then 24, 20, and 16 points for fourth. And guess how many entries there were for 2022? Just four cars. Quite literally last place gets you 16 SL points in a closed wheel racing championship. That is more points than getting 4th in Indy car.

    And to be fair some of the races did have more than 4 cars, since Perguet joined in round 4 with two cars and Glickenhaus pulled their one car out out after 4 rounds. But that one round did feature SIX cars! Pretty crazy. Also silly since drivers get full points despite 3 of them sharing the car through the event. Two strong drivers could carry a weaker third.

    Definitely a fair system.
    Yes the system is extremely flawed but I dont have a problem with WEC being awarded higher points either. WEC team isnt one that you can easily buy a seat for, they are all (mostly) manufacturer backed teams. No team is going to give up an important seat just because you pay.

    F2 is the easiest to buy a seat for and still be "competitive".

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    So if the rumors are true and RBR is well over the budget cap last year, what should the punishment be? Will the FIA have the balls to strip them of the championships? Going over by 7-10m is a massive advantage. Either FIA is strict and actually punishes them, otherwise, everyone just going to blow through the cap and treat it like a luxury tax.

    I have zero confidence in FIA changing any meaningful results.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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    If you look at what has happened to racing the last few season since DTS came out and they are flush with cash, I can't see them doing a single damn thing. I don't recall if the penalties for exceeding the cap was set out, but that wouldn't surprise me that they didn't put something in place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by npham View Post
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    If you look at what has happened to racing the last few season since DTS came out and they are flush with cash, I can't see them doing a single damn thing. I don't recall if the penalties for exceeding the cap was set out, but that wouldn't surprise me that they didn't put something in place.
    The penalties are set out, at least, what options they have. Exclusion from events, points deductions, exclusion from championship. Both drivers and constructors. Reduction in future cost cap. The problem is, the cost cap was supposed to be audited by March but because 2 teams went over it’s been dragged out till now when this seasons almost done. Imagine stripping championships a year later. That’s why I can’t see it happening and the cost cap becomes a joke going forward.

    I was trying to think what pro sports disqualified cheaters, only one I could think of was lance armstrong. Even historically in F1 the big penalties were meaningless (Schumacher dsq after legit losing in 97, mclaren stripped of constructor points which really is just a financial penalty).
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    So if the rumors are true and RBR is well over the budget cap last year, what should the punishment be? Will the FIA have the balls to strip them of the championships? Going over by 7-10m is a massive advantage. Either FIA is strict and actually punishes them, otherwise, everyone just going to blow through the cap and treat it like a luxury tax.

    I have zero confidence in FIA changing any meaningful results.
    I agree with you I don't think FIA will do anything. If they don't impose any meaningful penalty it is game over for Cap.

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    I’d genuinely be surprised if RB is over the cost cap. Not because I don’t think they would overspend but because a team as big and versed in marketing as RB would 100% be smart enough to game the numbers in a way to not go over the cap. There’s so many tiers to RBR, RBPT, RBAT, and then all the Alpha Tauri potion that it’d be a huge blunder for them to not submit something within the cap.
    Nolan

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    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    The penalties are set out, at least, what options they have. Exclusion from events, points deductions, exclusion from championship. Both drivers and constructors. Reduction in future cost cap. The problem is, the cost cap was supposed to be audited by March but because 2 teams went over it’s been dragged out till now when this seasons almost done. Imagine stripping championships a year later. That’s why I can’t see it happening and the cost cap becomes a joke going forward.

    I was trying to think what pro sports disqualified cheaters, only one I could think of was lance armstrong. Even historically in F1 the big penalties were meaningless (Schumacher dsq after legit losing in 97, mclaren stripped of constructor points which really is just a financial penalty).
    If you think they all are not cheating your dreaming … but we shall see in few days

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    They aint gonna do shit. F1 needs Red Bull more than the other way around. See Ferrari for history trend

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    Nice to see Perez pot another W. Definitely deserved it after a flawless drive today minus the SC gap confusion. Glad it didn't change the outcome but hopefully they sort out dealing with those issues in a more timely manner or clarify the issue.
    Nolan

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    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    Nice to see Perez pot another W. Definitely deserved it after a flawless drive today minus the SC gap confusion. Glad it didn't change the outcome but hopefully they sort out dealing with those issues in a more timely manner or clarify the issue.
    That race today was a giant clusterfuck lol. The rain and the humidity took out 1/4 of the grid haha and what the fuck with GR
    Doing It For the 'Gram

    I ain't worried 'bout it right now..

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    Seemed like max was the only one with the performance to be able to pass. Great race for checko, charles definitely had pace at the beginning of the stint but it faded off.

    I think with all sports if you ain’t cheating you ain’t trying. If you get caught you have to pay up. It would be nice if it was a fair field and everyone playing by the books but that will never happen.

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    Seeing Mercedes drivers fucking up brings me joy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pheoxs View Post
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    I’d genuinely be surprised if RB is over the cost cap. Not because I don’t think they would overspend but because a team as big and versed in marketing as RB would 100% be smart enough to game the numbers in a way to not go over the cap. There’s so many tiers to RBR, RBPT, RBAT, and then all the Alpha Tauri potion that it’d be a huge blunder for them to not submit something within the cap.
    That's pretty much what every team is doing, submitting financial data that says they're compliant. RBR and AM (the 2 rumoured offenders) thought they're smarter than everyone else. FIA audit team is just calling shenanigans on their claims.

    Ferrari, Mercedes, Williams and McLaren were decent vocal about the implications of going over the cap. Going $7m over (5%) works out to 70 engineers, enough people to develop a full car concept on their own, so there's massive gains to be had for going over 5%. Mercedes is really pissed about it because they let go 40 engineers last year to be compliant.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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    It’s pretty funny how Horner keeps bitching that “how could they know”.

    Does he understand the concept of a rumour?
    Originally posted by Thales of Miletus

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    Originally posted by Toma
    fact.
    Quote Originally Posted by Yolobimmer View Post
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    guessing who I might be, psychologizing me with your non existent degree.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Team_Mclaren View Post
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    Seeing Mercedes drivers fucking up brings me joy.
    Seeing Mercedes drivers fucking up and Crofty and Brundle actually admitting it brings me even more joy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rage2 View Post
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    That's pretty much what every team is doing, submitting financial data that says they're compliant. RBR and AM (the 2 rumoured offenders) thought they're smarter than everyone else. FIA audit team is just calling shenanigans on their claims.

    Ferrari, Mercedes, Williams and McLaren were decent vocal about the implications of going over the cap. Going $7m over (5%) works out to 70 engineers, enough people to develop a full car concept on their own, so there's massive gains to be had for going over 5%. Mercedes is really pissed about it because they let go 40 engineers last year to be compliant.
    TIL F1 engineers get paid 100k

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    Quote Originally Posted by riander5 View Post
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    TIL F1 engineers get paid 100k
    It's probably LESS than 100k, with 100k including benefits and what not that the cap will consider as total cost of employment. F1 pays like shit, unless you're a driver, a big name team principal, or Adrian Newey. You have a lot of people lining up to do those jobs to be part of the circus, so almost all F1 jobs pay at the bottom of the scale, unless you can single handedly deliver results.

    It's a massive revolving door. Everyone seems to work there a couple years, then head off with some great real world experience for a real paying job.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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