2022 f1

[shakalaka]

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I started skimming the comments as soon as I started to see they were devolving into mostly insults (though they've all been kinda funny).

Some of the pods I've listened to have talked about how overpowering the DRS is, which led to some shenanigans like Leclerc and Verstappen heading into that final straight, which was also the same location as the Verstappen-Hamilton brake-check incident.

Do you think there's any validity to the argument that DRS has made passing TOO easy now, and that there is more appeal in watching cars work for a pass that will stick, than watching cars swap leads every other DRS zone?

I think F1 achieved exactly what they wanted, which is to draw more people to the sport - by making the races more 'exciting'. I don't think anyone will say it's too easy with the whole DRS thing just yet, but I guess time will tell how the new regulations age. I do think that it leaves things much more open to these sort of incidents happening where consequences could be more serious when you have more aggressive/careless drivers like Max on the track. But so far this season he seems to be playing fair with Leclerc, so perhaps he just really hates Lewis to have driven that way against him.

[schocker]

Another excellent race with lots of passing and action. Still don't really like the track though as obviously it is quite dangerous for the drivers with some of the curbing and the concrete walls and then also the missile attacks.

[rage2]

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What’s funny is this move as well as Brazil move would’ve resulted in Max penalty with this years new rules.

[pheoxs]

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What’s funny is this move as well as Brazil move would’ve resulted in Max penalty with this years new rules.

Would it have? The gif is kind of fast but it looks like when there is contact there is still over a car width of space on the inside?

Or do you mean a penalty because Max went right then left on the straight and you can't block like that?

[OTown]

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I started skimming the comments as soon as I started to see they were devolving into mostly insults (though they've all been kinda funny).

Some of the pods I've listened to have talked about how overpowering the DRS is, which led to some shenanigans like Leclerc and Verstappen heading into that final straight, which was also the same location as the Verstappen-Hamilton brake-check incident.

Do you think there's any validity to the argument that DRS has made passing TOO easy now, and that there is more appeal in watching cars work for a pass that will stick, than watching cars swap leads every other DRS zone?

The whole point of DRS was that the cars couldnt follow on the turns, therefore would allow cars to catch up/keep up/pass on the straights. If the new regs are going to significantly help with cars following each other (ie more like karting) then I think they should probably get rid of it. Or at least make it much less powerful.

[OTown]

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What’s funny is this move as well as Brazil move would’ve resulted in Max penalty with this years new rules.

I still think this was basically a pit maneuver. Lewis wasnt going to make that apex. He did the same thing to Albon a few years back in Austria

[pheoxs]

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The whole point of DRS was that the cars couldnt follow on the turns, therefore would allow cars to catch up/keep up/pass on the straights. If the new regs are going to significantly help with cars following each other (ie more like karting) then I think they should probably get rid of it. Or at least make it much less powerful.

DRS at Saudi in particular is quite overpowered having 3 drs zones right after each other. They should’ve only had 2.

[Misterman]

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I started skimming the comments as soon as I started to see they were devolving into mostly insults (though they've all been kinda funny).

Some of the pods I've listened to have talked about how overpowering the DRS is, which led to some shenanigans like Leclerc and Verstappen heading into that final straight, which was also the same location as the Verstappen-Hamilton brake-check incident.

Do you think there's any validity to the argument that DRS has made passing TOO easy now, and that there is more appeal in watching cars work for a pass that will stick, than watching cars swap leads every other DRS zone?

I don't see anything wrong with DRS, it does increase passing which makes the race more exciting. What I think is silly is a track like Jeddah having back to back DRS zones like that, which starts these silly games like Leclerc and Max got into.

[Misterman]

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I still think this was basically a pit maneuver. Lewis wasnt going to make that apex. He did the same thing to Albon a few years back in Austria

I can't believe salty Ham fans are still arguing about this.

[rage2]

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Would it have? The gif is kind of fast but it looks like when there is contact there is still over a car width of space on the inside?

Or do you mean a penalty because Max went right then left on the straight and you can't block like that?

The new overtaking rules basically give precedence to the driver on the inside, they just have to leave a car width on the outside, with no expectation to hit the apex or anything. They can take the widest line they want as long as they don’t force the outside driver off the track. That goes for an outside or inside overtake. Whoever is on the inside basically dictates the line.

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I still think this was basically a pit maneuver. Lewis wasnt going to make that apex. He did the same thing to Albon a few years back in Austria

The difference with Albon in Brazil was that it was a divebomb. At no time was Hamilton significantly alongside until the collision, so Hamilton would’ve been penalized under the new rules still.

That’s the gist of the new rules as published by media. I’ve never seen the actual rules, nobody has published them, but the racing has been a lot cleaner and better in the first 2 races across the field, especially on lap 1.

[killramos]

Max:

“Rules unclear, what’s another driver”

[Misterman]

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The new overtaking rules basically give precedence to the driver on the inside, they just have to leave a car width on the outside, with no expectation to hit the apex or anything. They can take the widest line they want as long as they don’t force the outside driver off the track. That goes for an outside or inside overtake. Whoever is on the inside basically dictates the line.


The difference with Albon in Brazil was that it was a divebomb. At no time was Hamilton significantly alongside until the collision, so Hamilton would’ve been penalized under the new rules still.

That’s the gist of the new rules as published by media. I’ve never seen the actual rules, nobody has published them, but the racing has been a lot cleaner and better in the first 2 races across the field, especially on lap 1.

So Hamilton still would've been boned by those rules at Silverstone when he rammed Max off with that dive bomb. Not that it mattered, easy to eat a 10 second penalty when you took your competitor out of the race already. Or I suppose under the new rules, Max would've had to anticipate the dive bomb, then go wide and let Hamilton understeer into the side of his car.

[pheoxs]

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The new overtaking rules basically give precedence to the driver on the inside, they just have to leave a car width on the outside, with no expectation to hit the apex or anything. They can take the widest line they want as long as they don’t force the outside driver off the track. That goes for an outside or inside overtake. Whoever is on the inside basically dictates the line.

I get that, but by frame 3 here they had already made contact. There is easily a car width and then some for Hamilton on the inside.

Oh I see what you mean. It's on Max to not collide because Hamilton has 'the line'. That seems ripe for abuse though, what stops Drivers from just not turning in like Hamilton did and hitting their tire.

[OTown]

So if your understanding of these new rules is correct, as long as you have the inside line you can divebomb and take out the other guy.

That's exactly what happened to Albon v Stroll last weekend on the last few laps, minus the high speed part. Stuck his nose on the inside. Albon has since been given a 3 place grid penalty for the next race.

[rage2]

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Oh I see what you mean. It's on Max to not collide because Hamilton has 'the line'. That seems ripe for abuse though, what stops Drivers from just not turning in like Hamilton did and hitting their tire.

My guess on these rules? The inside driver can’t force the outside driver off track, has to leave them room, that’s what stops the inside driver from taking the outside driver out. The onus is on the outside driver to not close up and leave minimal room for the inside driver, because the inside driver can not back out of a corner. If the outside driver has to back out so much that the inside driver left no room, forcing outside driver off track, inside driver is at fault and has to give up the advantage.

So basically, they expect the outside driver to back out if inside driver takes on too much speed. If they have to back out of it to the point where they’re forced off track, inside driver gets the penalty. Giving the line to the outside driver is a recipe for disaster. If you want the advantage, protect the inside. Both were alongside only at the time of collision.

That’s my best guess at why the new rules were done this way.

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So if your understanding of these new rules is correct, as long as you have the inside line you can divebomb and take out the other guy.

That's exactly what happened to Albon v Stroll last weekend on the last few laps, minus the high speed part. Stuck his nose on the inside. Albon has since been given a 3 place grid penalty for the next race.

You’re missing the significantly alongside part of the rules. If you’re not significantly alongside, you have zero right to any line.

Again, I haven’t seen the new rules (seems like only teams and media has seen it but not publishing it), or when you need to be significantly alongside, but the Albon Stroll collision, he wasn’t alongside until way after braking. That’s a divebomb. Just like Hamilton Albon was a divebomb.

I’m surprised at the lack of understanding of what a divebomb is with some of you guys.

[Misterman]

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I’m surprised at the lack of understanding of what a divebomb is with some of you guys.

Pot meet kettle? Or you're finally agreeing that Silverstone was a Hamilton divebomb, after literally describing it verbatim using the names Albon and Stroll.

[OTown]

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My guess on these rules? The inside driver can’t force the outside driver off track, has to leave them room, that’s what stops the inside driver from taking the outside driver out. The onus is on the outside driver to not close up and leave minimal room for the inside driver, because the inside driver can not back out of a corner. If the outside driver has to back out so much that the inside driver left no room, forcing outside driver off track, inside driver is at fault and has to give up the advantage.

So basically, they expect the outside driver to back out if inside driver takes on too much speed. If they have to back out of it to the point where they’re forced off track, inside driver gets the penalty. Giving the line to the outside driver is a recipe for disaster. If you want the advantage, protect the inside. Both were alongside only at the time of collision.

That’s my best guess at why the new rules were done this way.


You’re missing the significantly alongside part of the rules. If you’re not significantly alongside, you have zero right to any line.

Again, I haven’t seen the new rules (seems like only teams and media has seen it but not publishing it), or when you need to be significantly alongside, but the Albon Stroll collision, he wasn’t alongside until way after braking. That’s a divebomb. Just like Hamilton Albon was a divebomb.

I’m surprised at the lack of understanding of what a divebomb is with some of you guys.

I will say that the Silverstone incident was quite a bit different due to dog leg, speed etc compared to a regular 'send it' divebomb into a hairpin or something...

I guess I'm just confused as to why these are examples of 'divebombs', but somehow Max would now be penalized for a Silverstone scenario? Makes very little sense. During that one, Lewis's front wheel hit Max's rear wheel. Although Max had the outside line on that one, he had priority on the racing line and was much further ahead, and was actually going to make the corner, whereas Lewis completely missed the apex. Other than simply stopping before the corner and letting the other go by, what is the guy who is on the outside with the lead supposed to do?

[rage2]

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I guess I'm just confused as to why these are examples of 'divebombs', but somehow Max would now be penalized for a Silverstone scenario? Makes very little sense. During that one, Lewis's front wheel hit Max's rear wheel. Although Max had the outside line on that one, he had priority on the racing line and was much further ahead, and was actually going to make the corner, whereas Lewis completely missed the apex. Other than simply stopping before the corner and letting the other go by, what is the guy who is on the outside with the lead supposed to do?

Because Hamilton was on the inside, and fully alongside giving the right to the inside line any way he wants as long as he leaves space for the outside car in this years rules. You keep ignoring the fact that he was fully alongside and keep calling it a divebomb for the last year. I really don’t understand this circular argument repeating itself. Pretty sure I’m being trolled at this point.

[npham]

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Pretty sure I’m being trolled at this point.

It's less about racing for these guys, and more about them hating Hamilton for xyz reason. It's basically the anti-vax group all over again by ignoring any details/facts that do not support their view(s) e.g. Abu Dhabi where the race director took liberties to make it "more exciting".

But at least it appears we have clear rules of engagement for the drivers and strong race direction e.g. Sainz/Perez safety car line. RBR knew they couldn't fuck around so they gave the place up. Last year, they would have waited to the end of the race to make a decision after negotiating back and forth, pleading their case.

[riander5]

Just to chime in as the newb who only has watched 3 seasons of drive to survive - Hamiltons moves fucking Albon over a few times when he got promoted to Red Bull were shitty moves IMO - does he do that alot?

Im neutral on Hamilton really but interested to see how he does this year without the best car on the track.