My Bad Experience with 12v(Jeff) re:install

[rage2]

Just stumbled on this thread...

Originally posted by redevil
Acura did go throught the install. The immobilizer was not working after Jeff was installing the unit. They had my car for 4 days and went through the wiring, and they only could find that the immobilizer was somehow fried.

This is coming from my experience with the RSX immobilizer and Hondata K series. The immobilizer is part of the ECU and ECU program. It works by signalling the key's internal chip during startup, and listening for the proper serial # response (kinda like those card systems for getting into buildings). If it matches to any key serial # within it's memory, it'll execute the code to start the car. If no match, it never makes it to the start code in the program and the car doesn't start. This is why it's next to impossible to break in and start RSX's, can't start it unless you replace it with your own ECU with your key info in it's memory, and have your key where the ECU can read it .

I've seen cases where the ECU "forgot" the key chip information after disconnecting and reconnecting the battery, and simply needed to be reprogrammed at the dealership. If your ECU has been modified (ie hondata), Honda will charge you to do this and won't cover it under warranty, even though it's a common problem. In this case, they blamed the compustar. It's a common RSX problem when disconnecting and reconnecting the battery. A stereo install or even jump starting a dead RSX can trigger this.

Judging from how much redevil paid, I don't think the immobilizer was "fried". I think it just lost the key information for whatever reason, and the dealership decided to charged him to uninstall compustar and reprogram the key info into the ECU. Either that or he got a smoking deal on the ECU cuz the RSX ECU retails at around $700usd. Correct me if I'm wrong heh.

What did the dealership write on the work order/invoice?

[Fordpower.ca]

id still like to know what he did

[12V]

I gave you $125 extra not $75 extra on top of the $350 i gave you back as well. and at the time we worked this out to be half, the $125 i gave you back right away, the $125 i gave you extra, this is $250 which is half of $500. at the time you were happy with this you even shook my hand. Money is not the problem, the thing is is that i was under the impression that this was already handled, If you were not happy you shouldn't have said everything that was cool and you shouldn't have shook me hand, to me that represented that this was finished. you should have called me and we could have worked this out, I don't mind doing what it takes to keep a customer happy. What your pretty much doing is trying to damage my reputation, and basicly blackmail me by bashing me on the net unless you get your way, this is a pretty low way of handling yourself in my opinion. I will give you another $125, to solve this, but I hope you realize your actions have probably cost me greatly.

Jeff (12v).

[redevil]

12v

Wether I gave you all of the $475 that you charge that night my car stopped working or even if I gave you $5, and you refunded my money and I gave back the Compustar. It still would leave me out $500 from the bill from Acura. Call me so I can explain to you again how that leaves me with a greater part of the bill.

I'm not trying to blackmail you. Call me so I can explain to you in further detail.

Ariane (780)436-5574 or cell (403)616-0028

rage2
This was the quick fix that I was hoping was only wrong with the car. I have the broken immobilizer in my glove box. And the reason why it is cheap is because I use to work at NW Acura so I was able to get the discount, it would of been much more money if I didn't know the people there.

[Fordpower.ca]

i still dont understand why the immobilizer was tampered with...

what happened?

[redevil]

Originally posted by Fordpower.ca
i still dont understand why the immobilizer was tampered with...

what happened?

Me too! When Jeff was almost done the install we see a black plastic cover on the floor of my car, I asked him if he knows where it was from and he told me he didn't know

Then when he goes to start the car the car won't start. We then later see that the cover was from the immbilizer unit, how it got taken off

As for the way the immobilizer was to be bypassed, he didn't use a bypass module thingy. I had to lose a key, and he used wire to wrap around the key to hide under the dash and used this method as a bypass module. Now I don't know if this is a common practice but it just didn't seem right to me. But I'm not the expert. So I was lucky that I still had Roadside assistance from Acura otherwise it would of cost me money for the towing.

[red2000]

Originally posted by redevil

As for the way the immobilizer was to be bypassed, he didn't use a bypass module thingy. I had to loose a key, and he used wire to wrap around the key to hide under the dash and used this method as a bypass module. Now I don't know if this is a common practice but it just didn't seem right to me.

that's a very normal and cheapest way to bypass the immobilizer

[redevil]

Originally posted by red2000


that's a very normal and cheapest way to bypass the immobilizer

Yeah, cheap for him but very costly for me

I would of rather paid the $50-80 that they normally charge for the bypass.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Originally posted by redevil

As for the way the immobilizer was to be bypassed, he didn't use a bypass module thingy. I had to loose a key, and he used wire to wrap around the key to hide under the dash and used this method as a bypass module. Now I don't know if this is a common practice but it just didn't seem right to me.

Strange... while it's true that method should bypass the immobilizer, it also means that anyone could come along and rip off your car... not a great idea, IMHO, but my lack of experience with immobilizer/ starter combos keeps me from knowing exactly how they interface with the ECU. Is it possible to temporarily bypass the immobilizer program (ie remotely start the car), but have an [auto-shutoff -> revert to immobilizer standby] function initialize if a control (ie gas pedal, brakes) are touched?

[Superesc]

Originally posted by BerserkerCatSpl


Strange... while it's true that method should bypass the immobilizer, it also means that anyone could come along and rip off your car... not a great idea, IMHO, but my lack of experience with immobilizer/ starter combos keeps me from knowing exactly how they interface with the ECU. Is it possible to temporarily bypass the immobilizer program (ie remotely start the car), but have an [auto-shutoff -> revert to immobilizer standby] function initialize if a control (ie gas pedal, brakes) are touched?

Somewhat off topic (and probably a dumb question)... I will split the thread if it continues... But if the immobilizer program is part of the ECU, does it mean that if you swap ECU you would lose the immobilizer function?

[Fordpower.ca]

ya that is a cheap way of doing, but effective. I still dont see why the unit was opened. I have installed many starters with this type of security in place and not one problem. all it is is a wire wrapped around a key and the tumbler connected by a relay activated by the starter.

is this 12v guy certified?

[rage2]

Originally posted by Superesc
Somewhat off topic (and probably a dumb question)... I will split the thread if it continues... But if the immobilizer program is part of the ECU, does it mean that if you swap ECU you would lose the immobilizer function?

AFAIK, only on the RSX and newer hondas. The older immobilizers were separate units. So on an RSX if u get a new ECU, you'd have to reprogram all your existing keys to the ECU to enable 'em.

Not sure what immobilizer redevil is talking about, maybe the key reading unit is a separate unit. I've never gone in that deep in an RSX, just know how the ECU functions and what it does.

And yes, the most common way is to "lose a key". This is why I don't replace the new generation of factory immobilizers with aftermarket alarms, there's really no way around 'em for 99% of the car theives out there. Doesn't really make sense to replace a near perfect solution with one that makes it a lot easier to steal your car.

[Fordpower.ca]

i dont think he was so concerned with someone stealing his car but just to remote start it...

i have the PATS system on my mustang (needs a special key to start) she aint going anywhere...

[403Gemini]

Originally posted by 12V
Well Aarian when all of this happened, your original charge for the compustar was $475 installed, right off the bat i gave you back the $125. You gave me $350 for the compustar, later after the the dealership diagnosed the problem, and removed the compustar, I asked if you wanted it reinstalled again (no charge obviously) you said no, so i said i could give you back the $350 and you were happy, then later you changed your mind and decided you want more money, so I gave you another $125 to keep you happy. and you were satisfied as we were splitting the bill.($125 and $125 is $250 which is half of a $500 bill) on the phone you were very happy that i was doing this for you and said that everything was cool. this was several months ago, and I haven't heard from you since, I assumed everything was still ok. If there was a problem why don't you just call me, you know my number, if not I'm sure your brother will give to to you. instead of bashing me online. I'm a very reasonable person and it is not uncommon that I will help someone at my own expense.

unfortunatly i do not have your phone number, but I would appreciate if you would call me and explain your sudden change of heart.

Jeff, 990-1764

sounds like unbelieveable customer support too me like weapon _R said shit happens, its how people deal with stuff and it seems like jeff did a pretty good job

[BerserkerCatSplat]

Originally posted by Superesc


Somewhat off topic (and probably a dumb question)... I will split the thread if it continues... But if the immobilizer program is part of the ECU, does it mean that if you swap ECU you would lose the immobilizer function?

Ah, sorry, I meant my post as less of a question than a suggestion. I was suggesting the possibility of installing some sort of chip that would temporarily bypass the immobolizer while remotely starting the car, instead of compromising the immoblilizer theft protection by using the wired-key method. My question should have been whether that sort of chip is actually available for installation in redevil's vehicle. Just a mild suggestion, no need for a thread split! Sorry for any confusion!

Edit: OK, I've found something like what I'm thinking of... it allows remote starting, but doesn't otherwise interfere with the immobilizer's anti-theft function. Looks like it'd work with redevil's RSX.
http://www.autotoys.com/x/cust/produ...?productid=360

Way better than the lose-a-key method, IMO.

[redevil]

Originally posted by 403Gemini


sounds like unbelieveable customer support too me like weapon _R said shit happens, its how people deal with stuff and it seems like jeff did a pretty good job

So replacing a part that didn't need replacing and having me out $500 is great customer service? If I had wanted a new immobilzer unit I would of gone to get one, I didn't need 12v to do that for me. He didn't even offer to cover the repair bill in the first place, I had to ask if there was anything else he could do besides reinstalling it. I wasn't willing to take another chance at him installing the unit.

PS I'm still waiting for Jeff (12v) to call me back. I've left messages and told him to let me know when the best time for me to call him back so I could explain my side but no reply....great customer service. I understand that he is a busy person but if he wants futher explaination he can reach me at (403)616-0028 or (780)436-5574


rage2
The unit I'm talking about that needed replacement is one that is located by you ignition, there is a module that wraps around the key ignition, with a black box.

[Ryan@DerdallDesigns]

Jeff is a very honest individual and is a excellent installer. Though this incident in very unfortunate we all need to take into consideration that accidents do happen. As I have worked along side Jeff in the past I can honestly say that he would not try and screw someone. It looks to me like Jeff has met you on all levels of your needs and has done everything in his power to fix the situation at hand. We all know that getting a hold of people at times can be a difficult thing...but to come on and mess with the guys livlyhood is not a very respectable thing to do at all.

Dont let this post hinder you from doing buisness with Jeff hes a good installer and knows his stuff. Accidents happen, its how they are delt with that shows the true stature of a individual.

[googe]

I dont think reddevil is doing anything wrong here...

Im sort of waiting for a response to the allegation that reddevil would have had to pay the immobilizer (repairs) out of his pocket

[redevil]

I'm still waiting for Jeff(12V) to call me back.
Hasn't replied or left a message.

[Barnes]

Original Post Removed. (Please read the Forum Rules and Terms of Use before posting again, or risk getting banned).