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    Default Non Smokers Only Apply



    From CBC.ca
    Some Canadian companies are following an American trend of refusing to hire smokers, even if they smoke in their off hours.

    A group of Canadian online companies, headed by Momentus.ca, have made it clear on their websites that they only hire non-smokers. It's a policy aimed at lowering health-related costs for employers.

    "It's well known that a smoker will get sick more frequently, will miss more time from work, even at work the smoker will likely be away from actual work longer than non-smokers ... and will actually cost the employer a fair amount of money," says Dr. Lew Pliamm of the Quit Clinic in Toronto.

    Medical ethicists say smokers should not be treated like pariahs because it's an addiction.

    "The fact that I may be at greater risk for cardiovascular disease or for other health problems because I'm a smoker isn't necessarily my fault and it shouldn't make me subject to discrimination," says ethicist Arthur Schafer of the University of Manitoba.

    At least 29 U.S. states agree and have banned employer discrimination against smokers. But in Canada, employment protection for smokers is largely untested, except for one case involving mining company Cominco in British Columbia in 2000.

    Companies in Canada are watching the American situation closely. At Weyco Medical Benefits in Michigan, workers aren't allowed to smoke at work or at home.

    "We want a healthy workforce," says Howard Weyer, the company's president.

    Weyco gave its employers two years' notice about its no-smoking policy and provided products and programs to help them quit. In the end, 20 workers did kick their habits and four were fired.

    Smokers cost Canadian companies $8 billion/year

    American companies are more likely to take the hard line because they pay their employees' health insurance premiums.

    Canadian companies are taking note because smokers still cost an estimated $8 billion a year in lost productivity. Smokers are absent two days more a year on average than their non-smoking counterparts and they take extended lunches and breaks, adding up to another 14 days of lost productivity.

    At the moment, employers in Canada can't fire their workers for smoking but they are allowed to advertise for non-smokers only.

    The Quit Clinic's Pliamm says as more employers adopt non-smoking policies, smokers may be more apt to quit their habit.

    "If they know that they won't be able to progress in life, to get to where they want to be because of their smoking, this gives them one added benefit in quitting."



    Does this constitute a form of discrimination? Well of course, so why isnt it being taken as seriously as, for example, racial discrimination? Maybe because this is indirectly very good for people's health.

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    I like this policy. I don't smoke and yet I see all the smokers going out for a 'smoke' break every hour or so. If I decided to go outside for 15min and my boss saw me, I would be asked why I was not doing anything and to get back to work. Why is that reasonable?

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    Originally posted by seer_claw
    I like this policy. I don't smoke and yet I see all the smokers going out for a 'smoke' break every hour or so. If I decided to go outside for 15min and my boss saw me, I would be asked why I was not doing anything and to get back to work. Why is that reasonable?
    It's not. Everyone is entitled to their breaks. Smoke breaks, coffee breaks, lunch breaks, watercooler breaks. Don't single out the smokers just because your boss doesn't let you take a break.
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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    can i take time off work to smoke crack too? j/k

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    Last edited by kaput; 03-13-2019 at 05:33 AM.

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    Originally posted by seer_claw
    I like this policy. I don't smoke and yet I see all the smokers going out for a 'smoke' break every hour or so. If I decided to go outside for 15min and my boss saw me, I would be asked why I was not doing anything and to get back to work. Why is that reasonable?
    I work at Future Shop and lots of our staff smoke, especially management. On a slow day, I will walk over to Tim Hortons to grab a drink and a donut and stand outside and eat it or I'll just goto the back and sit down for a bit. When questioned on why I am on a break I simply say I'm taking a smoke break. Its weird, smokers are given extra breaks (sometimes up to 2 or 3 times) but non-smokers are expected to work through the day (besides lunch).
    ---

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    I think we should just get to use smoke breaks as well (as non-smokers) not hiring smokers is kind of ridiculous.
    Mike

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    Originally posted by kaput
    I think its an awesome idea. Smokers have every right to make the choice to do so, but I think that in choosing to they should be required to forfeit their access to public health care and employer health insurance or any health insurance for that matter. I'm glad to see employers taking an active approach to curb the problem, if nothing else, I wish other employers would take the issue seriously enough to deal appropriately with people who choose to smoke during productive/paid time.


    Let's see you rant about "choice" now, rage2!!

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    Last edited by kaput; 03-13-2019 at 05:33 AM.

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    Originally posted by kaput
    I think its an awesome idea. Smokers have every right to make the choice to do so, but I think that in choosing to they should be required to forfeit their access to public health care and employer health insurance or any health insurance for that matter. I'm glad to see employers taking an active approach to curb the problem, if nothing else, I wish other employers would take the issue seriously enough to deal appropriately with people who choose to smoke during productive/paid time.
    Great idea!

    While we're at it, let's take public health care and employer health insurance for anyone who chooses to drink alcohol. After that, how about people that don't drive brand new cars. I mean, hell, the exhaust has some really toxic shit in there! Then, we should review everyone's hobbies. Anything with potential for danger, mountain biking, rock climbing, and *GASP* parachuting, let's take theirs away too.

    I mean really, that would make insurers happy. To insure only healthy people so they never pay out and just take your money.

    I'm voting you for mayor.

    (PS - smokers live longer)
    Originally posted by SEANBANERJEE
    I have gone above and beyond what I should rightfully have to do to protect my good name

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    Companies should have the right to do this IMO.
    Originally posted by BlueGoblin
    I have been on the pointy end of a few sticks...

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    meh....I think. This is gonna stir up some major shit for sure. As in future if more and more companies start going with that rule, I can pretty much bet on it that their are gonna be huge and never ending debates similar to gay marriage topic. Its almost impossible to get everyone to agree on one side. If more and more employers start to do that, I can see strikes, messed up work places and what not.

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    Originally posted by DEREK57
    Companies should have the right to do this IMO.
    yeah...i guess if smokers have the right to smoke then employers also have the right to not accept them as well. Thats democracy for ya....

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    Originally posted by rage2

    After that, how about people that don't drive brand new cars. I mean, hell, the exhaust has some really toxic shit in there!




    (PS - smokers live longer)
    Most people don't wrap their lips around the exhaust pipe

    Didn't read the other long ass topic, but even assuming that they do live longer (which I am skeptical about), I'd still think statistics would show that they cost more money to healthcare over their lifetimes (and even if you average it per year of life I still think it should be higher)

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    Originally posted by rage2

    Great idea!

    While we're at it, let's take public health care and employer health insurance for anyone who chooses to drink alcohol. After that, how about people that don't drive brand new cars. I mean, hell, the exhaust has some really toxic shit in there! Then, we should review everyone's hobbies. Anything with potential for danger, mountain biking, rock climbing, and *GASP* parachuting, let's take theirs away too.

    I mean really, that would make insurers happy. To insure only healthy people so they never pay out and just take your money.

    I'm voting you for mayor.

    (PS - smokers live longer)
    You know, you were arguing behind the philosophy that nonsmokers can CHOOSE to go to nonsmoking bars, so therefore smokers should also be able to choose smoking bars. Doesn't that same philosophy apply here? As in, if all you smokers can choose smoke-allowed employers, aren't we nonsmokers entitled to smoke-free employers? Less smokers in a workplace means less health-care costs, which means bigger paycheques for all of us at the nonsmoking workplace. If you choose to smoke, don't stifle our choice to be employed by higher paying, smoke-free employers.

    Of course, I realize that it's a bit of a stretch that the savings a company reaps will go directly towards the employees, but at least it opens that possibility.

    Originally posted by Singel
    Most people don't wrap their lips around the exhaust pipe
    Best burn of 2005!!!

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    I kind of agree with this... I work in an auto shop where a few of the guys smoke, but if we stand around and take a break we get in shit, if someone else stands around and has a smoke in their mouth puffin it, they dont get anything. I don't like the smoking idea, but I don't hate people because of it, but I also don't like being traded off and still having other health problems.i Dunno that probbaly doesnt make sense

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    Premium is higher for smoker in a life insurance policy.

    I think the same should be for health, or employer should forfeit their portion of the payment, but not withdrawn from coverage.

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    It is well-established that you can't discriminate based on something you can't change (ie. race, sexual preference, etc). The fact is we discriminate all the time, because business owners would be destroying their businesses by hiring anything but the best applicant.

    So the argument is that smoking doesn't really affect the day-to-day work.... except that smokers are likely to disappear regularly to smoke and are expected to be ill more often. Why can't an employer take that into account when figuring out if that person is the best choice?

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    I think it's a perfectly acceptable practice. I had a friend who owned a small business, located in an office building downtown. He hired non-smokers only, since the office was so small, he didn't want to have to put up with their smell all day. A potential applicant started a huge shit-fit against this guy, and in the end he won. It was decided that it was well within his rights as a business owner to not hire smokers. The argument about more sick days was also brought up, but he could not find any hard evidence at the time to support it. However, that does not mean it's not true. The relatively small number of smokers that I've worked with seem to support the argument that they are absent from work due to illness more than non-smokers, but in my case, it is a relatively small sample (~20 people)
    Originally posted by Vagabond142
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