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Thread: Should the UN Security council be charged with war crimes?

  1. #1
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    Question Should the UN Security council be charged with war crimes?

    "Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez condemned what he called "indiscriminate bombing" by the U.S. and its allies in Libya, saying Sunday that the assault is causing civilian casualties.

    Chavez, who has long-standing ties to Libyan leader Moammar Gadhafi, demanded the airstrikes be halted and echoed claims of civilian victims by the Libyan government, which said 48 people were killed.

    "Civilian victims have now begun to appear because some bombs are launched — 200, 400 bombs from out there at sea — and those bombs fall where they fall," Chavez said during his weekly television and radio program.

    "Libya is under imperial fire. Nothing justifies this," Chavez said, holding up a newspaper showing an explosion on the front page.

    "Indiscriminate bombing," he said. "Who gave those countries the right? Neither the United States, nor France, nor England, nor any country has the right to be dropping bombs."

    Chavez said African Union leaders were meeting in Mauritania to discuss the conflict.

    "That's what must be done, and going there to talk with the parties in the conflict, but not launching bombs, more bombs, more death," Chavez said. "We pray to God for peace in Libya."

    The Venezuelan president and several other leaders in Latin America have strongly opposed military intervention in Libya.

    On Saturday, delegates at a meeting of ALBA — a left-leaning bloc comprising Venezuela and seven other nations in Latin America and the Caribbean — accused Western allies of trying to seize Libya's oil.

    "We repeat our message from Venezuela, from the ALBA: We demand a halt to the attack against Libya," Chavez said Sunday. "What madness. ... It's imperial madness."

    Chavez frequently refers to the United States as "the empire."


    Indiscriminate bombings? That is war crime in my books.

    Source

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    Simple question.

    Is the UN breaking the law by invading another sovereign country?

    YES/NO

    The law says yes. Doesn't matter how you spin it. It's the law.
    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by broken_legs
    Simple question.

    The law says yes. Doesn't matter how you spin it. It's the law.
    It's too bad you have such a limited understanding of the way the world works. Why? Well, people with even less understanding might think what you say is correct. You're easily dismissed in many of these discussions because of that.

    No need for a wall of text in response.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    the UN is just looking out for its interests... an yes, despite whatever kahtofffey and chavez think, libya is the UN's interest.

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    Originally posted by CUG
    It's too bad you have such a limited understanding of the way the world works. Why? Well, people with even less understanding might think what you say is correct. You're easily dismissed in many of these discussions because of that.

    No need for a wall of text in response.
    It's easier to sound right, then it is to be right.
    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by broken_legs


    It's easier to sound right, then it is to be right.
    Neither of which are characteristics you possess

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Originally posted by CUG
    Neither of which are characteristics you possess
    Whenever you enter a debate it's not to bring anything to the table like
    -information
    -ideas
    -sources
    -facts

    It's just to puff out your chest and sound smart by attacking the messenger.

    Whatever makes you feel good man. I know you're jealous of the handlebars.

    /CUG derail
    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by broken_legs


    Whenever you enter a debate it's not to bring anything to the table like
    -information
    -ideas
    -sources
    -facts

    It's just to puff out your chest and sound smart by attacking the messenger.

    Whatever makes you feel good man. I know you're jealous of the handlebars.

    /CUG derail
    You're no messenger. You take selected bits of information and piece them together to present an anti-western position to earn dyno time. I don't argue with people when I'm wrong, only when I'm right.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Originally posted by CUG
    You're no messenger. You take selected bits of information and piece them together to present an anti-western position to earn dyno time. I don't argue with people when I'm wrong, only when I'm right.
    F it. Lets completely destroy this thread....


    I don't have an "Anti-Western" position. Keep putting words in my mouth. It's the only way you have a leg to stand on. I have a position that would like to see MY COUNTRY and the countries in the west mind our own business and focus on things at home.

    We aren't world police.

    Is it possible that you can disagree with the things your government does and still be a patriot?

    YES.

    Is it possible the worst kind of citizen is the one that falls in line with the media consensus and doesn't ask any questions?

    ^^^ This would be you, CUG.

    OK you can return to telling everyone how I hate the west now.

    Thx.
    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by broken_legs


    F it. Lets completely destroy this thread....


    I don't have an "Anti-Western" position. Keep putting words in my mouth. It's the only way you have a leg to stand on. I have a position that would like to see MY COUNTRY and the countries in the west mind our own business and focus on things at home.

    We aren't world police.

    Is it possible that you can disagree with the things your government does and still be a patriot?

    YES.

    Is it possible the worst kind of citizen is the one that falls in line with the media consensus and doesn't ask any questions?

    ^^^ This would be you, CUG.

    OK you can return to telling everyone how I hate the west now.

    Thx.
    Again with the wishful thinking. If the free world didn't pay mind to human rights violations abroad, we would be no different than those who stood idly by while the holocaust happened.

    Logically your also suggesting that we had no business being in Rwanda when 600,000 people were slaughtered (albeit a limited presence). Are you saying that no one should have stopped the Germans?

    Free and developed nations are the world police. We are the standard by which quality of life and democracy is held. The majority of the world believes these are fundamental freedoms that every human being should have. We ensure to the best of our abilities that they are afforded those freedoms.

    We are free nations with the ability to stop bad things from happening to innocent people. Your disagreement with that fact makes me concerned for any woman who might get raped in proximity to you. It's her own business, I guess.

    You just think it's about oil every time. You don't acknowledge the violence Ghadaffi is using on his people, because Russia said it isn't happening.

    Shame on you, mustache man. I don't think I could have painted a better picture of how flawed (to me, and many others) your thinking is on these issues.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Additionally, I find absolutely no ethical mistrust if an arrangement is made for a country to share resources after they've been liberated from an oppressive dictator.

    If you and I are neighbors, your basement floods and I give you all of my towels to soak up the mess, I'm more than okay with getting my towels back and you selling me cheap potatoes from the garden in your back yard.

    I avoid ignoring the fact that the majority of Libyans hate the regime that is in place. They want to overthrow him, he's killing innocent people.

    I'm going to paint my basement. That should give you adequate time to form a rebuttal.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Originally posted by CUG
    You take selected bits of information and piece them together to present an anti-western position to earn dyno time.
    SIg'd, now that is a conspiracy theory I can get behind!

  13. #13
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    Originally posted by CUG
    Again with the wishful thinking. If the free world didn't pay mind to human rights violations abroad, we would be no different than those who stood idly by while the holocaust happened.

    Logically your also suggesting that we had no business being in Rwanda when 600,000 people were slaughtered (albeit a limited presence). Are you saying that no one should have stopped the Germans?

    Free and developed nations are the world police. We are the standard by which quality of life and democracy is held. The majority of the world believes these are fundamental freedoms that every human being should have. We ensure to the best of our abilities that they are afforded those freedoms.

    We are free nations with the ability to stop bad things from happening to innocent people. Your disagreement with that fact makes me concerned for any woman who might get raped in proximity to you. It's her own business, I guess.

    You just think it's about oil every time. You don't acknowledge the violence Ghadaffi is using on his people, because Russia said it isn't happening.

    Shame on you, mustache man. I don't think I could have painted a better picture of how flawed (to me, and many others) your thinking is on these issues.
    OH very good points there CUG.

    Make me into a rapist now? Accuse me of supporting civilian atrocities?

    It's funny that you can totally ignore one side of what I'm saying "Invading Libya will kill more civilians" and then paint me as someone who doesn't care about civilian casualties.

    What else is funny, is that I started the Libya thread, posting up all of the atrocities that ghadaffi supposedly perpetrated. It was while doing this that I noticed there is no video or pictures of any of it. Meanwhile we manage to get 3-4 videos of every other little tid bit. It's just kind of strange... I would think that invading a country and killing thousands of people would require a higher level of proof - Does that sound reasonable to you?

    Meanwhile, allegedly a few hundred people got killed. Now we are going to kill a few thousand more while we systematically destroy a countries infrastructure, degrade the qaulity of life for millions of people, and bring an entire country back to the stone age. Don't forget the pro-west government that will sell off all of the natural resources for pennies and screw over the Libyan people. (Sharing Towels? lol)

    Your argument against me never takes into account anything I say. You never spend a moment to see the message I am putting forth, you only go line through line of every post trying to find something you can use as ammunition to make me look bad.

    Maybe one day you will parrot something other than the official party line.

    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by CUG
    Again with the wishful thinking. If the free world didn't pay mind to human rights violations abroad, we would be no different than those who stood idly by while the holocaust happened.

    Logically your also suggesting that we had no business being in Rwanda when 600,000 people were slaughtered (albeit a limited presence). Are you saying that no one should have stopped the Germans?

    Free and developed nations are the world police. We are the standard by which quality of life and democracy is held. The majority of the world believes these are fundamental freedoms that every human being should have. We ensure to the best of our abilities that they are afforded those freedoms.

    We are free nations with the ability to stop bad things from happening to innocent people. Your disagreement with that fact makes me concerned for any woman who might get raped in proximity to you. It's her own business, I guess.

    You just think it's about oil every time. You don't acknowledge the violence Ghadaffi is using on his people, because Russia said it isn't happening.

    Shame on you, mustache man. I don't think I could have painted a better picture of how flawed (to me, and many others) your thinking is on these issues.
    Oh please. That’s like a Sean Hannity monologue or something complied from a grade 8 social studies class. We could have an entire debate on the amount of BS you just slung, I’m just putting it out there as someone that completely does not agree with your assertions. As for, “does the UN or the US or w/e have the right to do what they are doing?” Sure. Rights are imaginary constructs invented to appease the psyche of the masses. The only rights the US needs is that it has a military capable of destroying the entire planet. So I’m not going to say that the US has no right to do what they’re doing. They have all the rights they need.

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    The empire strikes back!

    If they can charge the UN with war crimes, then they have to make Bush a war criminal in Geneva for torture. Maybe they all should be put away.

    Airplane bombing is awfully indiscriminate. As much as you can try to target the larger pieces of military hardware like tanks, its going to get messy.

    I am surprised myself that the vote got 10 nations onside.
    Cocoa $11,000 per tonne.

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    Originally posted by broken_legs


    OH very good points there CUG.

    Make me into a rapist now? Accuse me of supporting civilian atrocities?

    It's funny that you can totally ignore one side of what I'm saying "Invading Libya will kill more civilians" and then paint me as someone who doesn't care about civilian casualties.
    Just a question, why are you so intent on buying into Russia and their blatant excuse for their cowardly lack of involvement?

    How and why do you ascribe nobility to what they say and do when it's so clearly an excuse not to get involved?

    We're not invading Libya, brah.

    Edit: I meant to say, your overall thesis is uniform across pretty much everything you put down. The lack of attention I give you is more of a time saving effort. I have the information I've collected on the matter, I've done the math on its soundness, I've done the math on the likelihood of it being a ruse. My position on an issue isn't so fragile that it will meet its doom via arm-chair conspiracy theorem.




    Originally posted by BigMass


    Oh please. That’s like a Sean Hannity monologue or something complied from a grade 8 social studies class. We could have an entire debate on the amount of BS you just slung,
    I can assume by this statement that you do not trust your education, 8th grade included, therefore you do not present with even an 8th grade education. I guess you just dismissed yourself here.

    Absolutely debatable, but regardless, it's the structure of the world.
    Last edited by CUG; 03-20-2011 at 02:53 PM.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Originally posted by CUG

    Just a question, why are you so intent on buying into Russia and their blatant excuse for their cowardly lack of involvement?

    How and why do you ascribe nobility to what they say and do when it's so clearly an excuse not to get involved?

    We're not invading Libya, brah.

    This bit here just hi-lights how you are just out to smear me.

    I never said anything about Russia, and yet somehow now your argument is hinging on my opinion on Russia?

    You always make my opinions for me so you have something to argue against. You never argue against any of my actual positions.

    Invading/Attacking, w/e. The result is the same. All you can do is argue semantics and straw men.

    Go back your basement.
    TRUTH: it's the new hate speech.
    In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - Orwell

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    Originally posted by broken_legs


    Go back your basement.
    I fuckin will.

    Originally posted by teamPRO


    howbout suck my black kettle...

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    Originally posted by CUG

    I can assume by this statement that you do not trust your education, 8th grade included, therefore you do not present with even an 8th grade education.
    That makes no sense

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    I have nothing else to contribute.

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