Simple Traffic Question

[Crazyjoker77]

Heres my mspaint version of the intersection. I am always in lane "B" making a left turn and always get forced into lane 3 by traffic in lane "A".

http://i839.photobucket.com/albums/zz315/Cmartin87/lane_zpslaeqq2ug.jpg

This bugs me more than it should but I was taught you have to turn into the nearest available lane which would means "A" turns into 1 and "B" to 2 with no legal way to turn onto lane 3. I'm pretty sure I'm right but yet the only time I see people turn into lane 1 is if they are actually making a left hand turn. I know they could(and should) put markings through the intersection that could legally guide you into lane 2+3 but without any markings are you not required to use lanes 1+2 only?

[FraserB]

A turns into 1 and B turns into 2. It's not illegal to change lanes in an intersection, but if there was an accident, chances are the police would ticket the person changing lanes.

[firebane]

When A turns into lane 1 like they are supposed to they are to stay in that lane and do a proper shoulder check and then TURN into lane 2 when its clear for them to do so.

Too many people just turn from A into 2 without looking and cause headaches and accidents.

There are tooooooooooo many lanes like this and toooooooooooo many people who simply do not abide by the simple traffic rules because it inconvenieces them.

This is turning NB 14th onto WB 16th. People think you are supposed to turn into the turn lane but when you turn into your proper lane you almost collide with people and get a horn honked at you because again people don't pay attention to lane positioning.

[lilmira]

Be the first then it doesn't matter. If you ain't first, you are last. :burnout:

[jwslam]

I go B to 3 just to avoid exactly what you're talking about. And if I need to get into 1, then I just gun it in B to beat all the traffic from A wherever they're going.

[Masked Bandit]

I'm guessing that the people in A are simply turning too wide (into 2) so B by default has to swing wide into 3 to avoid an accident. The problem is that if someone is coming from the opposite direction to make a right hand turn into 3, then B has nowhere to go. I have a turn like this on the way home every day and it's pretty common for the same thing to happen. In a perfect world I would simply maintain my lane, let A hit me and then they would be at fault. The problem is that it's one thing to be right, it's something else to prove it. A lot of these side-swipe scenarios end up 50/50 because it's almost impossible to prove who was in the wrong lane. And a 50/50 claim does the same thing to your insurance as a full blown at-fault. Solution: drive a 1987 Chevy Suburban and maintain your lane...lol. Nobody's gonna screw with that.

[mr2mike]

Next time...
http://draw.accidentsketch.com/


Also that 14th N to 16th ave West... I always go into the right lane for turning for this very reason. Also 9/10 times, I will swing it wide and hit the far right lane as to avoid having to honk my horn. Also usually going to Home depot anyways.

[Mibz]

Honestly, this is the City's (or whoever's in charge of this shit) fault for not putting a dashed line forcing B into 3 and allowing A into 1 or 2. Forcing cars to turn into a left turn only lane is retarded design and causes a problem where one doesn't need to exist.

Glenmore WB to Elbow SB was awful for this until they put the line in.

[Moonracer]

Originally posted by Crazyjoker77
Heres my mspaint version of the intersection. I am always in lane "B" making a left turn and always get forced into lane 3 by traffic in lane "A".

http://i839.photobucket.com/albums/zz315/Cmartin87/lane_zpslaeqq2ug.jpg

This bugs me more than it should but I was taught you have to turn into the nearest available lane which would means "A" turns into 1 and "B" to 2 with no legal way to turn onto lane 3. I'm pretty sure I'm right but yet the only time I see people turn into lane 1 is if they are actually making a left hand turn. I know they could(and should) put markings through the intersection that could legally guide you into lane 2+3 but without any markings are you not required to use lanes 1+2 only?

You are 100% correct! This is one of those rules to the road that a lot of people either don't understand or just have no idea about, even though it's in the basic drivers handbook. I've actually had some idiot on the inside or first lane honk at me for taking my proper second lane!!!! :facepalm:



Originally posted by FraserB
A turns into 1 and B turns into 2. It's not illegal to change lanes in an intersection, but if there was an accident, chances are the police would ticket the person changing lanes.

Actually it is illegal to change lanes in an intersection in this case or any other. :)

[Tik-Tok]

Originally posted by Mibz
Honestly, this is the City's (or whoever's in charge of this shit) fault for not putting a dashed line forcing B into 3 and allowing A into 1 or 2. Forcing cars to turn into a left turn only lane is retarded design and causes a problem where one doesn't need to exist.

Glenmore WB to Elbow SB was awful for this until they put the line in.

True, but the dashed lines do nothing to help in winter... or spring, or summer, until they've been repainted in the fall because the winter spraying erased most of it.


Originally posted by Moonracer

Actually it is illegal to change lanes in an intersection in this case or any other. :)

No it isn't. It's bad driving, but not illegal.

[Moonracer]

Keep in mind that if there is a parked car or other obstacle in the first lane around the corner you are turning, then each lane is shifted over one.

[Moonracer]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok


No it isn't. It's bad driving, but not illegal.

Oh but it is

[Mibz]

Originally posted by Tik-Tok
True, but the dashed lines do nothing to help in winter... or spring, or summer, until they've been repainted in the fall because the winter spraying erased most of it. Fair enough, didn't consider that. I guess signs are a better solution.


Originally posted by Moonracer
Oh but it is No, it isn't. We've gone over this MANY times on Beyond. There is no law in Alberta which prohibits changing lanes in an intersection. If you find one, go ahead and post it up.

There is a charge for "Dangerous lane change" but it doesn't apply to ALL lane changes in intersections, only ones an officer deems dangerous.

[rage2]

If 1 is a turn lane, most people will go A -> 2 and B -> 3. Like Mibz says, that's the intention anyways, as all intersections that have the dashed lines will point you into those lanes, since it's rare for any driver to go A -> 1 unless you're doing it to pull a U-turn. Don't think there's anything in the TSA to actually define this particular situation.

Because the majority of drivers on the road are going A->2 and B->3, if you're in B trying to get into 2, you're probably going to end up in an accident/honked at/evasive maneuver. If I'm in A in the middle of a bunch of cars, I typically just pay attention to what's happening around me and carefully follow the herd. But most of the time, I just take B in these situations just to be safe.

[schocker]

Originally posted by Mibz
There is a charge for "Dangerous lane change" but it doesn't apply to ALL lane changes in intersections, only ones an officer deems dangerous.
Yup, I change lanes in an intersection all the time safely.

Lots of bridges have this lane setup though, and most are dashed as you can't expect someone to turn left and then turn left again and go back in the opposite direction. A good example is nosehill/crowchild or stoney/sarcee. Downtown there is a good one at 4th ave & 8th st SW where there are three turn lanes which go 1>1, 2>2, 3>3 but everyone treats it as 1>2. 2>3, 3>4. People are driving into me every time I turn there, even had somone turn from lane 1 into 3 the other day almost hitting me :rofl:

[killramos]

Here is a good example of the dashed line which works great. Never have issues on this intersecton which i use all the time

https://www.google.ca/maps/@51.0813332,-114.0333231,95m/data=!3m1!1e3

Someone can img it if they want im to lazy.

In this case person in left turning lane has option to go 1 or 2 but second turning lane goes to 3 ( far right lane)

In Calgary we have enough idiots that the city should do dashed lines for ANY double turn lanes. No one seems to get them.

I had someone honk at me for turning onto center street into the left lane while they were in the right this morning, apparently all these people need 2 lanes to turn left ffs :facepalm:

They should make negotiating a double turn lane part of the road test, with an automatic fail for turning into the wrong lane without signalling a change.

[rage2]

Originally posted by schocker
Downtown there is a good one at 4th ave & 8th st SW where there are three turn lanes which go 1>1, 2>2, 3>3 but everyone treats it as 1>2. 2>3, 3>4. People are driving into me every time I turn there, even had somone turn from lane 1 into 3 the other day almost hitting me :rofl:
4th Ave and 8th street is a completely different animal. There's lane markings but nobody follows it.

The biggest problem is that the 3rd lane (the curb lane) on 8th street allows parking for some stupid reason, so if you want to go to Kensington, you need to change lanes immediately after the parked car, make the turn to lane 3 onto 4th Ave to go to Kensington properly. Only problem is, you're not allowed to change into lane 3 at that point haha.

http://i1213.photobucket.com/albums/cc475/rage2amg/8th4th_zps21c5ba54.jpg

Whoever made those parking spaces there should be shot.

[CapnCrunch]

I'd just be happy the person in A actually turns instead of trying to go straight. I have this issue on my way home lol. Different intersection obviously.

[Mibz]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
I'd just be happy the person in A actually turns instead of trying to go straight. I have this issue on my way home lol. Different intersection obviously. It happens....

http://www.montrealgazette.com/sports/cms/binary/8499365.jpg

[rage2]

Originally posted by CapnCrunch
I'd just be happy the person in A actually turns instead of trying to go straight. I have this issue on my way home lol. Different intersection obviously.
Yea, this happens at the Crowchild EB -> Nose Hill NB intersection all the time. I need to pull some vids next time I'm there.

[Moonracer]

Originally posted by Mibz
Fair enough, didn't consider that. I guess signs are a better solution.

No, it isn't. We've gone over this MANY times on Beyond. There is no law in Alberta which prohibits changing lanes in an intersection. If you find one, go ahead and post it up.

There is a charge for "Dangerous lane change" but it doesn't apply to ALL lane changes in intersections, only ones an officer deems dangerous.

Ok then if it doesn't say in the ATSA then I stand "technically" corrected but in a round about way it is....lol Sure you won't be ticketed at random but if you lane change in an intersection and cause an accident then you will likely be charged.

[schocker]

Originally posted by rage2

4th Ave and 8th street is a completely different animal. There's lane markings but nobody follows it.

The biggest problem is that the 3rd lane (the curb lane) on 8th street allows parking for some stupid reason, so if you want to go to Kensington, you need to change lanes immediately after the parked car, make the turn to lane 3 onto 4th Ave to go to Kensington properly. Only problem is, you're not allowed to change into lane 3 at that point haha.



Whoever made those parking spaces there should be shot.
Don't worry. Soon 8th st will be 1 lane in each direction :rofl:

I do a triple left though from out by the enmax building into the furthest right lane so I can get onto 10th. I enjoy this turn though because I can make sure my horn is working because it happens 99% of the time. Line are clearly visible too, not like before they switched it and you could barely see anything.

If I leave before 6pm, I always had south to 6th ave, otherwise you can never get onto 8th northbound.


Originally posted by rage2

Yea, this happens at the Crowchild EB -> Nose Hill NB intersection all the time. I need to pull some vids next time I'm there.
Everyone at WB Crow to SB Nosehill turn into the left turn lane and the outside lane. I will cut into the left SB lane and have the dumb people in the turning lane get all panicky and it is great fun.

[rage2]

Originally posted by Moonracer
Ok then if it doesn't say in the ATSA then I stand "technically" corrected but in a round about way it is....lol Sure you won't be ticketed at random but if you lane change in an intersection and cause an accident then you will likely be charged.
If you lane change outside of an intersection and cause an accident, then you too will likely be charged. lol

[Moonracer]

Originally posted by rage2

If you lane change outside of an intersection and cause an accident, then you too will likely be charged. lol

Yes indeed point taken thanks lol
When I was a driving instructor we taught that it was basically illegal and to never do it and why you shouldn't do it of course. It was even an automatic fail if you did it on your drivers test, I don't know about now though.

Anyways for what it's worth
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu108/Moonracer/dual%20turns_zpsedm8wo0j.png
http://i638.photobucket.com/albums/uu108/Moonracer/turns_zpsqlaf77tr.png

[Masked Bandit]

Originally posted by Moonracer


Ok then if it doesn't say in the ATSA then I stand "technically" corrected but in a round about way it is....lol Sure you won't be ticketed at random but if you lane change in an intersection and cause an accident then you will likely be charged.

If you change lanes and cause an accident anywhere you'll be ticketed.

Driver training will teach you to avoid the practice of changing lanes in an intersection but there's nothing actually illegal about it.

[Moonracer]

^^^Rage beat you to it :D

[max_boost]

Originally posted by rage2
If 1 is a turn lane, most people will go A -> 2 and B -> 3. Like Mibz says, that's the intention anyways, as all intersections that have the dashed lines will point you into those lanes, since it's rare for any driver to go A -> 1 unless you're doing it to pull a U-turn. Don't think there's anything in the TSA to actually define this particular situation.

Because the majority of drivers on the road are going A->2 and B->3, if you're in B trying to get into 2, you're probably going to end up in an accident/honked at/evasive maneuver. If I'm in A in the middle of a bunch of cars, I typically just pay attention to what's happening around me and carefully follow the herd. But most of the time, I just take B in these situations just to be safe.

:werd:

[Dumbass17]

Originally posted by FraserB
A turns into 1 and B turns into 2. It's not illegal to change lanes in an intersection, but if there was an accident, chances are the police would ticket the person changing lanes.
you sure about that? I remember learning as a youngion that it is illegal to change lanes in an intersection

[Mibz]

Haha, alright guys, no need to have the same conversation three times.

[Moonracer]

:rofl: Why not it's an internet forum

[blairtruck]

Originally posted by Dumbass17

you sure about that? I remember learning as a youngion that it is illegal to change lanes in an intersection
well i was told that changing lanes in intersection is legal as long as safe to do so. same as passing on a solid line. as long as safe its legal.

[FraserB]

Originally posted by Dumbass17

you sure about that? I remember learning as a youngion that it is illegal to change lanes in an intersection

It's driving schools making up laws for no reason. It's even worse if they are failing people for it and forcing them to pay again for a second test.

[lilmira]

No changing lane in an intersection makes more sense than playground zone at 9pm IMO. What do I know?

[schocker]

Originally posted by lilmira
No changing lane in an intersection makes more sense than playground zone at 9pm IMO. What do I know?
Not more than city council, that's for sure! :rofl:

I believe I was also taught not to change lanes in an intersection and learned on beyond that it isn't illegal. I do it all the time now ie people turning left I travel in right lane and continue on in the left.

[Moonracer]

Originally posted by FraserB


It's driving schools making up laws for no reason. It's even worse if they are failing people for it and forcing them to pay again for a second test.

I wouldn't say that. I can't speak for all of the driving schools, cause some of them are kinda shady, but we didn't teach anything that wasn't the law. We were told and taught directly from the ATSA people (I don't remember their official title, it was a many year ago) that it is illegal. It's not something you get randomly ticketed for like speeding and whatnot but ya like I said call it what you will, if you lane change in an intersection and cause an accident because of it you will likely be charged.
One thing I've noticed lately is that the ATSA could use a little more detail in it.

[FraserB]

There is nothing in the Traffic Safety Act prohibiting a safe lane change in an intersection. If you told people it was illegal and docked points/failed them for it, you were 100% in the wrong.

[Moonracer]

^^^I was an INSTRUCTOR not a tester and if they want to give points/fail people for it then they can and did. You are entitled to your opinion and I get it.
For the most part I taught students not to change lanes in an intersection and why they shouldn't and that they would fail their test if they did it on their test. I don't know for sure if it's still that way now or not. ;)