Who is getting the COVID-19 Vaccine?

[rage2]

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So the WHO just advised that boosting with the original vaccine is ineffective...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...o-experts-warn

I was wondering why everyone was rushing to get boosted with an old product...

Pfizer and Moderna are targeting a March release for the new Omicron Vaccine - any bets on how long that product will be on the market before another variant replaces omicron?

Also interesting, seems like two doses and no booster means that within 6 months most protection is gone. I suspect there's going to be a split in the vaccinated between those who are 'One and Done' and those who believe that perpetually boosting is a safe and viable strategy.

It seems almost guaranteed that in the future, vaccines will not be the frontline product in the fight against covid. I bet we move to a strategy of outpatient management with oral therapeutics.

We go from this in December:

https://nationalpost.com/news/pfizer...gainst-omicron

To this:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ystem-ema-says
https://fortune.com/2022/01/12/ema-w...r-flu-endemic/

So is it becoming clear that perpetually boosting with the old vaccine is not effective and also dangerous. It also seems unrealistic that a new Omicron vaccine will save the day... given how frequent new variants appear.

This isn’t anything new. It is well known that current vaccines don’t do a lot for transmission. Everyone is catching it. What the vaccines are doing is lowering the chance of severe outcomes. This is why the hospitals are disproportionately admitted unvaccinated over vaccinated in the omicron wave, even though you aren’t able to comprehend the data properly. So it may not be the best solution using existing vaccines, but it certainly is effective. Can it be better? Sure. That’s why there’s an updated vaccines.

You realize flu vaccines are different every year right? And that they target completely different strains?

[killramos]

btwerk has a really hard time with numbers that aren’t 0 or 1.

[Xtrema]

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So the WHO just advised that boosting with the original vaccine is ineffective...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...o-experts-warn

I was wondering why everyone was rushing to get boosted with an old product...

Pfizer and Moderna are targeting a March release for the new Omicron Vaccine - any bets on how long that product will be on the market before another variant replaces omicron?

Also interesting, seems like two doses and no booster means that within 6 months most protection is gone. I suspect there's going to be a split in the vaccinated between those who are 'One and Done' and those who believe that perpetually boosting is a safe and viable strategy.

It seems almost guaranteed that in the future, vaccines will not be the frontline product in the fight against covid. I bet we move to a strategy of outpatient management with oral therapeutics.

We go from this in December:

https://nationalpost.com/news/pfizer...gainst-omicron

To this:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...ystem-ema-says
https://fortune.com/2022/01/12/ema-w...r-flu-endemic/

So is it becoming clear that perpetually boosting with the old vaccine is not effective and also dangerous. It also seems unrealistic that a new Omicron vaccine will save the day... given how frequent new variants appear.

Vax every 6 months or less also not the answer. But you are facing aliens with laser guns with your Smith and Wesson. It may not do much but at least try your best and take a few with you.

What are you going to do, wave white flag and bow like a coward?

We have said this for 2 years, nothing is a sure fire way to end this BS. Each advice we take we add certain percentage of safety but will never add up to 100%. Wear your mask indoor in public. Wash you hands. Get your shots. Keep social interaction to a minimum at least for the next week or so try to help hospitals out.

And looks like we ain't getting AHS's low end projection and will hit 1000 by end of this week instead of next week. So finally in the 5th wave, we land on the wrong side of AHS's projection?

[born2workoncars]

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This isn’t anything new. It is well known that current vaccines don’t do a lot for transmission. Everyone is catching it. What the vaccines are doing is lowering the chance of severe outcomes. This is why the hospitals are disproportionately admitted unvaccinated over vaccinated in the omicron wave, even though you aren’t able to comprehend the data properly.

1. Omicron is more virulent and less pathogenic
2. Omicron infection is significantly less likely to result in hospitalization, vaxxed or unvaxxed
3. Have there been studies done to prove that legacy covid vaccination reduces hospitalization in Omicron infection? You could argue that the reduction in hospitalization is due to the virus itself being less pathogenic.
4. How do antibodies produced by the original vaccine differ from Omicron antibodies? IE: If you're infected by Omicron, would that confer reverse protection against Delta/OG Covid etc?
5. It appears ICU's are still disproportionately unvaccinated (50% unvaxxed in ICU but only 25% of population is unvaxxed), but hospitalizations are more proportional to the vaxxed/unvaxxed population (75% pop full vaxxed, 75% hospitalizations fully vaxxed) - this could be a result of incidental covid (hospitalized WITH covid vs hospitalized BECAUSE of covid)
6. Yes, the WHO and Europe advising that frequent boosters aren't a solution and also potentially harmful to the immune system is a new admission - did you have news of this before today?

I'm interested in how many ICU admissions are infected with Omicron vs Delta. Has Omi completely displaced Delta? Do Omi severe outcomes present differently than Delta?

Finally:

Why do we still have vaccine mandates? If triple vaxxed can still infect and spread just as easily as unvaxxed, It seems we've past the point where they would serve an effective purpose.

[ExtraSlow]

you guys should put B-twerk on ignore. There's no dialogue possible there. Ignore is this forums greatest feature.

As for the AHS projections, case counts, hospitalizations etc, I know our leaders say that "everyone getting it" isn't a path out of this pandemic, but I kinda sorta think it may be. I mean, I'm personally trying to avoid infection, but I'm not super worried about my own risks if I do get infected, and in terms of "society" having massive case counts, well, I think that might be a good thing. If the long term number of deaths is fixed, we may as well get those deaths over with. The people in my life who are at highest risk have stopped caring, I've mostly stopped caring.

There's a lot of real scientists and armchair scientist and I'm not either. just a tired guy who tried his best and sometimes likes statistics.

[JRSC00LUDE]

B2 will you acknowledge your misunderstanding/misrepresenting of mathematical data to this point and demonstrate an understanding of that portion of the facts? If not, the rest of your talking points aren't likely to be received with any seriousness. Stop shooting yourself in the foot before the race even starts if you want anyone to hear you.

[killramos]

In this decade googling for “links to support my predefined conclusion” is what passes for “thinking” or “science”

Btwerk is just a very ordinary antivaxxer in this regard, same as a suburban Karen who gets their facts from Facebook.

[Xtrema]

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2. Omicron infection is significantly less likely to result in hospitalization, vaxxed or unvaxxed

No. AB stats remains that unvaxxed still more likely to be hospitalized and in ICU. 10x less likely but 100x more people infected still put more people in hospital with fixed and diminishing resources.

[born2workoncars]

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No. AB stats remains that unvaxxed still more likely to be hospitalized and in ICU. 10x less likely but 100x more people infected still put more people in hospital with fixed and diminishing resources.

2. Omicron infection is significantly less likely to result in hospitalization, vaxxed or unvaxxed

So hospitalizations increase due to volume, but you appear to agree that you're more likely to be infected with omicron and less likely to be hospitalized

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Vax every 6 months or less also not the answer. But you are facing aliens with laser guns with your Smith and Wesson. It may not do much but at least try your best and take a few with you.

What are you going to do, wave white flag and bow like a coward? I believe this is the 'let er rip' sentiment on the forum

We have said this for 2 years, nothing is a sure fire way to end this BS. Each advice we take we add certain percentage of safety but will never add up to 100%. Wear your mask indoor in public. Wash you hands. Get your shots. Keep social interaction to a minimum at least for the next week or so try to help hospitals out.

1. Hand washing is always intelligent - but that isn't how covid spreads?
2. Wear your mask indoor in public - seems like the consensus is rapidly becoming that masking is nearly useless (as done by the general pop), especially in schools
3. Get your shots - absolutely, are you suggesting getting boosted as well?
4. Keep social interaction to a minimum - Viable short term mitigation strategy

I think you could add these points to that list

1. Stop smoking
2. Reduce consumption of harmful substances (shit food, alcohol, drugs, etc)
3. Get physical health dialed in (intelligent supplementing, Vit D/K2, Zinc/Mag etc)(Strength training and cardio)
4. Get mental health dialed in (eliminate fear and anxiety, start meditating, read philosophy)
5. Gargle with sterilizing mouthwash and insufflate betadine nasal spray solution after public interactions to reduce viral load

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B2 will you acknowledge your misunderstanding/misrepresenting of mathematical data to this point and demonstrate an understanding of that portion of the facts? If not, the rest of your talking points aren't likely to be received with any seriousness. Stop shooting yourself in the foot before the race even starts if you want anyone to hear you.

Not super concerned on whether guys like killramos and Penis take me seriously - these are dudes with full time jobs and families that spend the majority of their time shitposting on the internet. Hard to take someone like that seriously lol. Penis comes off as a boomer whose figured out that anon-shitposting is his new favorite past time - power to him!

Are you referencing the Venn diagram that I modified to demonstrate the proportion of vaxxed and hospitalized patients as a ratio of the available pool of vaxxed hosts to
infect?

You and Rage2 think I was trying to demonstrate that 75% of the vaccinated population is in the hospital, lol. That is incorrect.

75% of the total population in Canada is vaxxed.
75% of hospitalizations are vaxxed.
This is a proportional representation of the population. You would expect the majority of hospitalizations to be unvaxxed if the vaccines were effective, even with 75% of the population vaccinated, because despite being a minority of the population, the unvaxxed are the most susceptible to disease.

I think this is likely due to hospitalized with covid instead of hospitalized because covid. I would assume many of the vaccinated, hospitalized patients are there for something other than covid, but then get tested and are added to this data set. Can anyone confirm this?

The ICU still reinforces the notion that vaccination reduces severe outcomes, but didn't we have 95% of the ICU population as unvaxxed a few months ago when we were still 70%+ vaxxed in total population? That's quickly moved to 50/50 even though were still well under 80% total pop double vaccinated.

Regardless, the vaccinations have been a huge disappointment when considering the initial expectations of them. Hopefully the March release of the Omicron vaccine product results in sterilizing immunity so that we can actually stop the spread.

[gpomp]

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you guys should put B-twerk on ignore. There's no dialogue possible there. Ignore is this forums greatest feature.

As for the AHS projections, case counts, hospitalizations etc, I know our leaders say that "everyone getting it" isn't a path out of this pandemic, but I kinda sorta think it may be. I mean, I'm personally trying to avoid infection, but I'm not super worried about my own risks if I do get infected, and in terms of "society" having massive case counts, well, I think that might be a good thing. If the long term number of deaths is fixed, we may as well get those deaths over with. The people in my life who are at highest risk have stopped caring, I've mostly stopped caring.

There's a lot of real scientists and armchair scientist and I'm not either. just a tired guy who tried his best and sometimes likes statistics.

So right now we are at 5000 cases per day and the population of AB is 4.4 million. My quick math says it'll take 880 days to infect everyone with Omicron. That seems like a long time to achieve "herd immunity"

[NoSup4U]

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So right now we are at 5000 cases per day and the population of AB is 4.4 million. My quick math says it'll take 880 days to infect everyone with Omicron. That seems like a long time to achieve "herd immunity"

Except your marth isn't factoring in that they are only capturing 1/10th of the actually cases with testing. And this was a conservative estimate by Hinshaw.

[Buster]

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So right now we are at 5000 cases per day and the population of AB is 4.4 million. My quick math says it'll take 880 days to infect everyone with Omicron. That seems like a long time to achieve "herd immunity"

thats now how infections work. it's not linear

[killramos]

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So right now we are at 5000 cases per day and the population of AB is 4.4 million. My quick math says it'll take 880 days to infect everyone with Omicron. That seems like a long time to achieve "herd immunity"

The number of cases per day is massively understated.

Marth isn’t going to solve this pandemic

[Xtrema]

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So right now we are at 5000 cases per day and the population of AB is 4.4 million. My quick math says it'll take 880 days to infect everyone with Omicron. That seems like a long time to achieve "herd immunity"

We are not testing any more and we have not been testing except symptomatic for a few days/weeks already. Waste water from Jan 5th for Calgary and area shows 6x more infected than previous worst wave, expect Omi to be spreading a lot faster than testing has shown.

[lilmira]

Breaking news, science says the infected shit 6 times more than the uninfected. More stories after the commercials, toilet paper price skyrockets!

[born2workoncars]

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I'm interested in how many ICU admissions are infected with Omicron vs Delta. Has Omi completely displaced Delta? Do Omi severe outcomes present differently than Delta?

The preliminary data shows that of the 708 people in hospital, 163 of those hospitalized have the Omicron variant. Of the 80 in ICU, 14 are Omicron patients.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/edmon...aths-1.6311437

So it looks like Omicron hasn't displaced Delta, yet

[Tik-Tok]

Omicron is less severe, so only using hospitalization numbers will give a very skewed result.

[JRSC00LUDE]

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It doesn't matter if I don't have math right

Ok, I'm out.

[Buster]

lol, you guys can't spot a troll for shit

[JRSC00LUDE]

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lol, you guys can't spot a troll for shit

I like to play sometimes. That isn't good trolling though, that's just bad brains. And not in the groundbreaking late 1970's HC punk way either.