Alberta 2019 Provincial Election

[sabad66]

I don’t think he’s Toma. I specifically remember Toma was a huge fan of trump... thought it was odd since he also really liked the ndp. I suppose it’s possible he got off the trump train but pretty unlikely

Edit: nm, I guess I was thinking of gestalt. So hard to keep track these days. Maybe it is actually toma

[dirtsniffer]

They're all in some way Toma

[kertejud2]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I don’t think he’s Toma. I specifically remember Toma was a huge fan of trump... thought it was odd since he also really liked the ndp. I suppose it’s possible he got off the trump train but pretty unlikely

Edit: nm, I guess I was thinking of gestalt. So hard to keep track these days. Maybe it is actually toma

Toma was more of a contrarian than anything. I'm pretty sure he was a Milosevic supporter.

[davidI]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Clipped from a Chain email I got.. Havent done any fact checking on it though.

Debt
When the NDP took over in 2015, Alberta had no provincial debt. The debt is forecast to be $71 Billion next year and is projected to grow to over $100 Billion in the next 4 years, IF the NDP are re-elected.

There was already some provincial debt in 2015 but obviously the NDP have inflated it incredibly while somehow also managing to shrink the economy at the top of an economic cycle - not to mention meddled with the Alberta Heritage Fund.

I think this September 2018 article is a good read for every Albertan to realize the dumb policies of both Conservative and NDP governments over the past few decades: https://www.policyschool.ca/wp-conte...rton-final.pdf

[HiTempguy1]

This gem reappeared a couple days ago lol

https://business.financialpost.com/o...-heritage-fund

[R-Audi]

IMO, Greg Clark is one of the lone bright spots in the 'other' group of parties..too bad Im not in his riding anymore, as he is easy to vote for. (But some say may end up as a vote split between NDP/UCP)

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...iggest-scandal

I completely forgot about the Balancing Pool mess..

"One of the first things the NDP government did — just one month after winning power on May 5, 2015 — was make changes to the carbon tax on large greenhouse gas emitters — such as coal-fired power plants, which then triggered a “hand-back provision” in the contract, explained Clark.

But the NDP didn’t want to hand anything back.

“Instead, the NDP doubled down in their ideological view and sued all of those power producers, and instead of accepting back the power purchase agreements through the balancing pool, they pushed back and required the balancing pool to sue these power producers.”

The outcome?

“They ultimately settled out of court in every case but, make no mistake, the government lost those lawsuits. But the people who really lost are Albertans, because that cost us literally billions of dollars as a result of the NDP’s ideologically driven disastrous decision,” said Clark.

The easiest way to look at it is that from about 2004 to 2014, most residential electricity customers would get $2 to $3 back from the balancing pool on their electricity bills. They had a surplus of about $700 million. That deficit is now around $1 billion. So they’ve taken a positive $700 million and turned it into negative $1 billion.

“Now, if you look at your electricity bill, you’ll see a balancing pool rider, which is negative $2 or $3. If it fully reflected the true cost of electricity it would probably be closer to $20 because the NDP has funded the balancing pool by adding to Alberta’s debt to trick Albertans into thinking that it hasn’t been as big a disaster as it has been,” said Clark.

In essence, because of the complexity of electricity and by adding this almost $2 billion cost into Alberta’s ballooning provincial debt (now at $53 billion) they have hidden this boondoggle from taxpayers."

[Misterman]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

This is VERY helpful. Thanks for posting that.

Makes it look like UCP's plan is "Go back to X the way it was" with one that I really don't understand the point of - "Exempt Alberta from CMHC Stress Test". Can someone explain why this is a benefit?

I must have missed reading that one?

But the benefit to being exempt from CMHC stress test is that the real estate economy increases. The stress test in Canada was kind of redundant, being that we have a less than 1% default rate on mortgages as it was.

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

UCP CANNOT balance the budget. It's impossible when resource revenue is down to 1/4 of what it was. What, you're going to slash health and infrastructure to 0.25? Haaaaaa

These bozos couldn't balance the budget if oil was $100. Too crooked. They'll hurry in the tax breaks for their buddies, that's priority one, then slash our health, infrastructure, do more selling of public assets, that type of stuff. Corrupt people like UCP have no interest in everyday Albertan's.

But fuck it, I was reading about the candiadates and districts today, and man, you gotta vote for a guy named Gar Gar. He wins by name alone!

So by all means please fill us in on how the alternative is better? It's all fine and dandy to call a spade a spade when discussing UCP, but if the alternative is multitudes worse, then where do we stand with our vote? This is no different than any other election in the history of the world. You vote for the lesser of two evils..........................Or you don't understand long term effects of corrupt economic policies and you vote for the NDP to keep implementing them.

[pheoxs]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Clipped from a Chain email I got.. Havent done any fact checking on it though.


Now that Notley and the NDP are campaigning for re-election, after 4 years in power, prudent voters need to examine the NDP record before marking their ballots on election day. I will not try to unduly influence your vote but it is my fond hope that you will review and understand the facts set out below and make an informed decision in the best interests of your family, city and province on election day.
Personal Wealth
Over the last 4 years Alberta’s net financial assets have decreased by $47 Billion. During that period the equity in Alberta housing has decreased by an estimated $27 Billion. Based on a population of 4.3 million, that means that every man woman and child is on average $15,000 poorer today than in 2015 - $60,000 for a family of four.

The average house price across Canada has fallen, not sure how the NDPs magic stick would change that.

Jobs
In 2014, 431,000 individuals were employed in the resource sector while 467,000 were employed in education, healthcare and public administration. (all numbers from Statistics Canada). In late 2018, 401,000 individuals were employed in the resource sector while 551,000 were employed in education, healthcare and public administration. During that period the public sector added 84,000 jobs (18%) while that portion of the private sector shrank by 7%. The government’s share of total employment is now 23.2% - the highest in decades.

The global oil price tanked, doesn't matter what Alberta did, layoffs were happening before the NDP came into power. Also adding public sector jobs during a recession is the basis of Keynesian economics. You spend public money when private investments are at their low to try and spur the economy on, then when things pick back up you reel things in and let the private sector roll along. Unemployed people sitting on EI don't help the economy. But people working end up spending the majority of their money and it re-injects it into the economy.

Taxes
Corporate and personal income taxes (provincial & federal) have increased dramatically and we now also have a carbon tax which was not mentioned in the NDP’s 2015 campaign.

Personal income taxes only rose for those making over 130k a year and it rose by 2%, boo hoo. For the carbon tax, although Alberta started early, its now a federal mandate and regardless of NDP or UCP in control its not avoidable.

Cost of Government
Even after 4 very tough years, the cost per capita ($12,717 ) of delivering Alberta’s government services, continues to be 14% higher than the average cost for the 4 largest provinces. No attempt has been made to reduce those costs or otherwise balance them with the vastly reduced revenues experienced during the downturn.

The median wage of an Alberta worker is 14% higher than BC, 15% higher than Ontario, and 21% higher than Quebec. Our labour across all industries is more expensive so comparing per capita isn't really a fair comparison. McDonalds here spends more on labour than a McDonalds in BC, that's just the cost of doing business

Debt
When the NDP took over in 2015, Alberta had no provincial debt. The debt is forecast to be $71 Billion next year and is projected to grow to over $100 Billion in the next 4 years, IF the NDP are re-elected.

While I do think the NDP has spent more than they should have, people often forget that the PCs had put forward a budget deficit of 5 billion in 2015 as part of their campaign and it included oil numbers that were more rosey than what we actually experienced. In fact the PCs themselves foretasted several years of deficits to recoup the shortfall from falling crude prices. That being said, I do think they overspent by a few billion.

What About all of the Other Social and Non-Financial Issues?
Healthcare wait times? Average class sizes? New schools & hospitals? Environmental stewardship? Human rights? Personal freedoms? Commitment to the arts? The rights & freedoms of the LGBTQ and other defined groups? Other social issues?

My thoughts on a lot of this. People often forget that our economy was tanking during the election, oil prices were falling, and the reason the PCs called an election early was they had proposed a budget with the largest deficit in recent history and wanted the public to vote on it.

[HiTempguy1]

And as we've discussed ad nauseum, it pales in comparison to what the NDP has done.

Good lord you people, just straight up admit you don't care hoe large of a deficit the NDP runs, at least we can have an honest conversation then.

[Buster]

World oil prices are less relevant than the WCS differential and the inflows of investment capital into the province. The NDP did nothing to solve either of those problems, and almost certainly made them worse. They were a test case for bad policy, and now we know.

Keynesian economics is a bad idea. Gov'ts don't create wealth. Counter-cyclical gov't spending like you describe is damaging to the recovery process - "smoothing out the dips" in the economic cycle simply delays necessary re-pricing of labour and goods.

[Stuart]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

And as we've discussed ad nauseum, it pales in comparison to what the NDP has done.

Good lord you people, just straight up admit you don't care hoe large of a deficit the NDP runs, at least we can have an honest conversation then.

You keep talking about NDP this, and NDP that...We remember you are the one who voted for them in the first place. Stop telling other people how to vote, as your next "short term pain for long term gain" may just be the move that really does end our province.

[HiTempguy1]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

You keep talking about NDP this, and NDP that...We remember you are the one who voted for them in the first place. Stop telling other people how to vote, as your next "short term pain for long term gain" may just be the move that really does end our province.

I'm still happy with the decision. It destroyed the PCs, a real conservative party has formed, and it should set us up for years of prosperity.

You may not remember, but the PCs were going to bring in a PST. That would have greatly affected everyone. So I still think the right choice was made. I wanted a minority NDP gov though, not a majority, which is where a lot of the real harm occured.

The NDP brought in the carbon tax (not campaigned on), killed northern gateway (not campaigned on) and wrecked our electrical agreements (not campaigned on). It certainly was an eye opening experience, and a mistake I won't make again.

[bjstare]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm still happy with the decision. It destroyed the PCs, a real conservative party has formed, and it should set us up for years of prosperity.

You may not remember, but the PCs were going to bring in a PST. That would have greatly affected everyone. So I still think the right choice was made. I wanted a minority NDP gov though, not a majority, which is where a lot of the real harm occured.

The NDP brought in the carbon tax (not campaigned on), killed northern gateway (not campaigned on) and wrecked our electrical agreements (not campaigned on). It certainly was an eye opening experience, and a mistake I won't make again.

Years of prosperity based on what? Do you think a conservative govt will just magically renew foreign investment in the energy sector (the investment that picked up and ran away over the last four years due to both the current federal and provincial govt policy/action/inaction)? Because that's a necessary piece of the puzzle for this prosperity to occur.

[Brent.ff]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

killed northern gateway (not campaigned on)

When did the AB NDP suddenly become federal?

[dubhead]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

I'm still happy with the decision. It destroyed the PCs, a real conservative party has formed, and it should set us up for years of prosperity.

You may not remember, but the PCs were going to bring in a PST. That would have greatly affected everyone. So I still think the right choice was made. I wanted a minority NDP gov though, not a majority, which is where a lot of the real harm occured.

The NDP brought in the carbon tax (not campaigned on), killed northern gateway (not campaigned on) and wrecked our electrical agreements (not campaigned on). It certainly was an eye opening experience, and a mistake I won't make again.

I think the PC's/Wildrose/UCP what ever you want to call them are still exactly the same and imho they could use another 4 years in the penalty box. It seems to me they need more time so they can finally remove their heads from their asses or should I say from their shot callers asses in industry.

NDP carbon tax was brought in as answer to the Feds ramming their own down our throats.

The NDP did nothing to kill Gateway the Feds with BC did that with red tape and a tanker ban on the north coast

I'll agree the power contracts was a disaster however I'm willing to chalk it up to inexperience at the beginning of their term.

I'm just going to throw it out there as unpopular has it is but I'm going to vote for the NDP for many reasons but below are the highlights

-They've slid much farther towards the center than anyone would have guessed alienating themselves from the federal NDP
-I'm sick of all the left vs right crap and fell they are more aligned to comprises and the center
-The PC/UCP/wildrose are acting like the same power hungry entitled brats they have always been
-Most of the things I have issue with the NDP time was how they handled a number of issues at the beginning of their term mainly power contracts and handling of the protection for farm workers, which need to be done but could have used more finesse. I see these as blunders from lack of experience and the NDP of today is no longer the inexperienced highly ideological party it was before. I see them as greatly matured and want to see what they can do with 4 more years
-I would hardly blame the current state of oil and gas on them and don't see the UCP doing any better at pulling us out of this hole
-Pipelines have been a disaster but that has mostly been the fault of BC and the feds I can't see loud mouthed Kenney making any head way on this, he will just cement western stereotypes and alienation in eastern Canada
-Kenney is a snake from Ottawa out for power and to enrich himself, it's going to take a whole lot more than putting on a cowboy hat and driving a big truck around the province to convince me otherwise. Notely is at her core an Albertan and i believe she truly cares about Alberta even if I don't see eye to eye with her party on a lot of things.


There's probably more reason than than come to mind at the moment...

[Buster]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

When did the AB NDP suddenly become federal?

They are the same party.

[16hypen3sp]

The NDP platform basically comes down to this: we had four years to balance the budget, we made a promise to balance it in the 2015 election campaign. We couldn't balance it so fuck it all, we are going to spend every last dime we have. Vote for us.

[rage2]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

The NDP platform basically comes down to this: we had four years to balance the budget, we made a promise to balance it in the 2015 election campaign. We couldn't balance it so fuck it all, we are going to spend every last dime we have. Vote for us.

It's pretty funny when you put it that way, because it's so true.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4s...ew?usp=sharing

Good thing I saved the 2015 PDF before they nuked it haha.

[asp integra]

Notley looked about 10-15 years younger only 4 years ago hahaha

[ExtraSlow]

This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

Notley looked about 10-15 years younger only 4 years ago hahaha

Have you seen those obama comparison pics? Guy aged thirty years in his terms.