Hong Kong vs China 2019

[benyl]

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Dynasties comes and goes. When Xi dies or removed, it'll become a different game.



This is what outsiders don't understand. It's more wild than wild west and CCP in Beijing doesn't know what's going on and only react with a heavy hand when someone fucks up on the ground level, like this COVID outbreak.

When I was in Hong Kong 12 or so years ago (Wedding), when I was talking to the locals, they were all saying that China is far more capitalistic that the West. Politically, fully communist. Financially, total freedom with plenty of bribing.

[Xtrema]

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When I was in Hong Kong 12 or so years ago (Wedding), when I was talking to the locals, they were all saying that China is far more capitalistic that the West. Politically, fully communist. Financially, total freedom with plenty of bribing.

Basically how Tencent operates.

Do whatever the fuck you want until Xi strongly suggest you can't.

[Buster]

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When I was in Hong Kong 12 or so years ago (Wedding), when I was talking to the locals, they were all saying that China is far more capitalistic that the West. Politically, fully communist. Financially, total freedom with plenty of bribing.

The locals don't know what capitalism actually is, I assume.

And yes, it is central planning.

[killramos]

China isn’t capitalist. They are just corrupt.

[01RedDX]

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[Xtrema]

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The locals don't know what capitalism actually is, I assume.

And yes, it is central planning.

In some way you are right. It's however you can make a buck until central government say no.

There are just as much pissed off businesses in China as our Canadian pork producers when Central gov blocked the import.

Yeah, this looks like central planning to me:
https://www.scmp.com/news/china/poli...ts-forced-give

If nudes for loan isn't pure capitalism, I don't know what is.



I hate CCP as much as you but I'm more a realist.

[Antonito]

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China thinks they can do what has been proven to not work time and time again: central planning.

Humans aren't built to flourish in the long term under central planning and totalitarianism - it isn't robust. The rest is just details.

Long term is relative, there's lots of examples of empires that have lasted centuries. I'd imagine for all his talk of never ending prosperity that Xi would be happy with dying as supreme emperor of the biggest country in the world, and let his grandkids deal with the eventual successful revolution.

[Buster]

You guys are funny:

"China can dominate because central planning allows them to be more strategic and longer term thinkers. Also, China is not centrally planned and is a vibrant capitalist economy."

China is just like every other totalitarian centrally planned regime. They work until they don't, then kablooey. Corruption, social unrest, rapid escalation in wealth inequality, etc. They all lead to the same destination eventually.

[Xtrema]

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You guys are funny:

"China can dominate because central planning allows them to be more strategic and longer term thinkers. Also, China is not centrally planned and is a vibrant capitalist economy."

China is just like every other totalitarian centrally planned regime. They work until they don't, then kablooey. Corruption, social unrest, rapid escalation in wealth inequality, etc. They all lead to the same destination eventually.

Truth. But does it matter if the end doesn't come in my lifetime?

[Buster]

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Truth. But does it matter if the end doesn't come in my lifetime?

It might.

The US has a lot of flaws, but you definitely would rather live in a world run by an American hegemony than a Chinese one.

[01RedDX]

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[Buster]

If it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck.

[max_boost]

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It might.

The US has a lot of flaws, but you definitely would rather live in a world run by an American hegemony than a Chinese one.

100%! Buster is like Beyond's Ben Shapiro lol Always ready for a debate, fast talking and facts hitting. Fk your feelings etc. haha

[Power_Of_Rotary]

As I said before, China has already deteriorated HK's autonomy. Had arguments here with you fellow beyonders too. China tried using the sneaky bill to silence the oppositions/noise. Now it is as direct and straight forward as possible.

just like: 7/21 -triads attacked citizens and protesters in train station
8/31- police attacked (argued that a few were actually killed) citizens and protesters in the train station

The list of shit China has done in the past 10 years can go on for miles. It is only until recently the world is giving a fuck because the virus actually impacted their lives.

The world prior to 2019: Cheaper manufacturing, more consumerism, more profit = blind eye to slave labor, no human rights, spreading communist ideologies to trading countries, and muting democratic countries/organisations with monetary blackmail.

CCP is a cancer that the world let spread and grow out of control. We are all accountable lol.

[Xtrema]

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As I said before, China has already deteriorated HK's autonomy. Had arguments here with you fellow beyonders too. China tried using the sneaky bill to silence the oppositions/noise. Now it is as direct and straight forward as possible.

just like: 7/21 -triads attacked citizens and protesters in train station
8/31- police attacked (argued that a few were actually killed) citizens and protesters in the train station

The list of shit China has done in the past 10 years can go on for miles. It is only until recently the world is giving a fuck because the virus actually impacted their lives.

The world prior to 2019: Cheaper manufacturing, more consumerism, more profit = blind eye to slave labor, no human rights, spreading communist ideologies to trading countries, and muting democratic countries/organisations with monetary blackmail.

CCP is a cancer that the world let spread and grow out of control. We are all accountable lol.

But $399 iPhone SE tho. lol

[tonytiger55]

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Anyone with property or investment in HK should have been working on an exit plan for a while. This highlights why.
Wonder if this will drive up the price of real estate in Lower Mainland BC? Drive it up more I mean.

The increased lack of a proper immigration plan has contributed to it. The NDP in Alberta have blood on their hands on this one, they fucked this up intentionally, all for their own careers and pension.
With the Canadian economy getting a hard kick in the bollocks, a good immigration plan will allow those with wealth to immigrate, invest and create businesses. Thus in turn will create jobs in our great country and kick start the economy. The British have been doing it for a good few hundred years. Im super surprised Canada has not caught onto it yet.

In relation to some of the other comments on here about China and if it can survive. Can China really innovate? That is a key question to its survival. Its rise has been made on the back of copying and modifying. How can any Chinese business flourish without a hostile takeover from the government?
Once people do make their wealth in China, they want to get out. One of that pathway have been through HK.

[Xtrema]

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The increased lack of a proper immigration plan has contributed to it. The NDP in Alberta have blood on their hands on this one, they fucked this up intentionally, all for their own careers and pension.
With the Canadian economy getting a hard kick in the bollocks, a good immigration plan will allow those with wealth to immigrate, invest and create businesses. Thus in turn will create jobs in our great country and kick start the economy. The British have been doing it for a good few hundred years. Im super surprised Canada has not caught onto it yet.

In relation to some of the other comments on here about China and if it can survive. Can China really innovate? That is a key question to its survival. Its rise has been made on the back of copying and modifying. How can any Chinese business flourish without a hostile takeover from the government?
Once people do make their wealth in China, they want to get out. One of that pathway have been through HK.

HK's status is also how scammers and corrupt $ gets out. China want to crush HK for a long time to get at these people. COVID give them the perfect opportunity. The lost of HK, is also why Chinese businesses that can flee are fleeing now to get out of CCP control.


As for immigration, I'm not sure what NDP has to do about it, it's a federal matter, not a provincial one. Harper era has ended investment class since 2014 as too many mainlanders got in via that program. I understand the reason behind it since a lot of these immigrants have businesses tied to China which mean they will mingle with CCP in some capacity. As many are now entering Canadian politics, this may introduce even more CCP influences. Economic class immigrant (assuming you are one of them) are still welcomed. But only city seem to have a open door policy before COVID is Halifax.

While investment class in theory brings wealth to the an area, in practice I don't think it'll have that much impact. I think economic class has way bigger impact than investment class as it actually generate productivities.

[Antonito]

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HK's status is also how scammers and corrupt $ gets out. China want to crush HK for a long time to get at these people. COVID give them the perfect opportunity. The lost of HK, is also why Chinese businesses that can flee are fleeing now to get out of CCP control.


As for immigration, I'm not sure what NDP has to do about it, it's a federal matter, not a provincial one. Harper era has ended investment class since 2014 as too many mainlanders got in via that program. I understand the reason behind it since a lot of these immigrants have businesses tied to China which mean they will mingle with CCP in some capacity. As many are now entering Canadian politics, this may introduce even more CCP influences. Economic class immigrant (assuming you are one of them) are still welcomed. But only city seem to have a open door policy before COVID is Halifax.

While investment class in theory brings wealth to the an area, in practice I don't think it'll have that much impact. I think economic class has way bigger impact than investment class as it actually generate productivities.

Investment class is a double edged sword. Construction in Vancouver has been propped up by speculative real estate for years, but has also made the cost of living virtually unsustainable.

[Xtrema]

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Investment class is a double edged sword. Construction in Vancouver has been propped up by speculative real estate for years, but has also made the cost of living virtually unsustainable.

Any immigration will increase housing demand. But investment class tends to look for a good investment to park the money until they get citizenship and real estate is a solid way to go.

I also heard there is a huge demand of wine in China that a lot of Chinese money has flowed into Okanagan valley, not sure how it's been the last few years.

[Antonito]

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Any immigration will increase housing demand. But investment class tends to look for a good investment to park the money until they get citizenship and real estate is a solid way to go.

I also heard there is a huge demand of wine in China that a lot of Chinese money has flowed into Okanagan valley, not sure how it's been the last few years.

Immigration of people that are lower to middle class will increase demands the same way that birth rate does. Investment class is bringing in people with more money than the average Vancouverite buying multiple properties. Essentially Vancouverites are competing with fellow Vancouverites AND the richest people from a country with almost 2 billion people