Trudeau has to go?

[vengie]

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What if you can afford to pay off the car in full, but choose to allocate the money to an investment where the return outpaces the cost of borrowing?

Attachment 97953

75% of people won't have a clue what that means, nor know how.

[ExtraSlow]

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it's crazy how much cash flow can be tied up in car payments.

This is a fun tangent. I knew a couple who's monthly car payments were $2200, and they were in no way wealthy. I have this pathological aversion to monthly payments. For anything actually. They make my skin crawl, so I try to have fewer of them, and smaller ones for the ones I do have.

[davidI]

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The average Canadian can't even keep their own household finances in order... you think they have a darn clue on a much larger scale?

Perhaps that's what makes them relate to the Liberals lol

https://www.680news.com/2021/03/08/t...al-budget/amp/

[Tik-Tok]

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What if you can afford to pay off the car in full, but choose to allocate the money to an investment where the return outpaces the cost of borrowing?

That would be a very unique circumstance to exist. You'd basically need an 8 year term with zero percent interest, and at least 12.5% annually from your investment. This is for purchasing of course. Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm not as financio savvy as some here.

[davidI]

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What if you can afford to pay off the car in full, but choose to allocate the money to an investment where the return outpaces the cost of borrowing?

Attachment 97953

There's cheaper margin available for most "investments". E.g. interactive brokers offers margin at <1% and most banks will lend at low rates for sensible investments.

[JRSC00LUDE]

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Man people get really worked up over car payments.

There are just too many people making MB payments on a KIA budget but again, a good explanation for the state of the Country.

[kertejud2]

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Exactly. They think he's doing a great fiscal job, because he's treating the countries budget exactly as most Canadians are treating their household budget.

To admit he's doing a shitty job is admitting they themselves are as well. After all, a household budget just balances itself.

It's more that people realize it isn't about 'balanced budget' vs deficit. All parties run deficits. Provincially, federally, they've all seen it before. Big C, Big L, small c, small l, it's the same story.

Take Ontario for example. They've seen it all, they aren't going to buy that any party or ideology is better at balancing budgets than the other. Rae and the NDP ran deficits. Harris and the PCs ran deficits. McGuinty and the Liberals ran deficits. Meanwhile at the federal level Chretien ran surpluses, Harper ran deficits. At the end of the day the one that hurt people the most was Harris, because while he ran the smaller of the deficits, it came on the backs of reduced services, increased fees, increased municipal taxes because part of the "savings" of the provincial government was just downloading costs to them, and the sale of public assets (which look good briefly on the balance sheet, but didn't actually save people money, since they're still paying the road tolls, still paying for services, etc.) kicking capital projects down the line if not cancelling them altogether.

So it comes down to what's the difference between a deficit while giving people money, and a deficit without giving people money? It's a vote of 'what deficit lets me come out better.' For some it's a 2% reduction to the GST is more important than a balanced budget, for others it's $2K of financial relief a month because we aren't working is more important than a balanced budget.

[ExtraSlow]

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It's more that people realize it isn't about 'balanced budget' vs deficit. All parties run deficits. Provincially, federally, they've all seen it before. Big C, Big L, small c, small l, it's the same story.
...
So it comes down to what's the difference between a deficit while giving people money, and a deficit without giving people money? It's a vote of 'what deficit lets me come out better.' For some it's a 2% reduction to the GST is more important than a balanced budget, for others it's $2K of financial relief a month because we aren't working is more important than a balanced budget.

Accurate, and I hate saying it.

[killramos]

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There are just too many people making MB payments on a KIA budget but again, a good explanation for the state of the Country.

The simple math says the average Canadian owes 300k on their home. And 25k on their car. On an average gross income of 48k/year. That’s not including credit card or student debt.

Those are scary numbers to try and reconcile.

And the Liberals think they will be able to convince Canadians to pay more taxes for more services?

Oh right. The rich will pay for it all.

[ExtraSlow]

Those fucking rich.

[JRSC00LUDE]

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So it comes down to what's the difference between a deficit while giving people money, and a deficit without giving people money? It's a vote of 'what deficit lets me come out better.' For some it's a 2% reduction to the GST is more important than a balanced budget, for others it's $2K of financial relief a month because we aren't working is more important than a balanced budget.

I feel it only fair to again acknowledge when you're absolutely correct.

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Those fucking rich.

The only people who think I am rich are the ones who can't balance a chequing account and, the Government.

[ThePenIsMightier]

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The simple math says the average Canadian owes 300k on their home. And 25k on their car. On an average gross income of 48k/year. That’s not including credit card or student debt.

Those are scary numbers to try and reconcile.

And the Liberals think they will be able to convince Canadians to pay more taxes for more services?

Oh right. The rich will pay for it all.

Holy fuck - is that real?!? I once again feel like I'm sitting in my doctor's office seeing the poster that says '40% of pregnancies are not planned' and saying "come on, that's not for real... Is it?" And then he goes "oh, Dude - it's closer to 50%!"

Are my idiot neighbours actually that fucked?! I would've thought the buyers of Denali trimmed Acadias had more fiscal acumen.

[vengie]

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Are my idiot neighbours actually that fucked?!

Yes.

[davidI]

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Oh right. The rich will pay for it all.

The rich being the upper middle class who have high incomes, rather than the actual rich who live off business, inheritance and investment income that's set-up in complex tax structures to take advantage of the holes in Canada's swiss-cheese tax laws.

[BerserkerCatSplat]

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Holy fuck - is that real?!? I once again feel like I'm sitting in my doctor's office seeing the poster that says '40% of pregnancies are not planned' and saying "come on, that's not for real... Is it?" And then he goes "oh, Dude - it's closer to 50%!"

Are my idiot neighbours actually that fucked?! I would've thought the buyers of Denali trimmed Acadias had more fiscal acumen.

Between Toronto and Vancouver they skew the national mortgage debt numbers pretty hard. Calgary is probably half that, if not less.

[ThePenIsMightier]

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Between Toronto and Vancouver they skew the national mortgage debt numbers pretty hard. Calgary is probably half that, if not less.

Agree. It's still pretty different from a situation I'm more familiar with.

[Tik-Tok]

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Between Toronto and Vancouver they skew the national mortgage debt numbers pretty hard. Calgary is probably half that, if not less.

In 2016, Calgary median mortgage debt was $260g, Vancouver $266g, and Toronto $280g.

[killramos]

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Holy fuck - is that real?!? I once again feel like I'm sitting in my doctor's office seeing the poster that says '40% of pregnancies are not planned' and saying "come on, that's not for real... Is it?" And then he goes "oh, Dude - it's closer to 50%!"

Are my idiot neighbours actually that fucked?! I would've thought the buyers of Denali trimmed Acadias had more fiscal acumen.

https://financialpost.com/executive/...on-these-items

https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/t1/tbl1...pid=1110023901

Based on what I can tell. Yes. They are.

[Buster]

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It's more that people realize it isn't about 'balanced budget' vs deficit. All parties run deficits. Provincially, federally, they've all seen it before. Big C, Big L, small c, small l, it's the same story.

Take Ontario for example. They've seen it all, they aren't going to buy that any party or ideology is better at balancing budgets than the other. Rae and the NDP ran deficits. Harris and the PCs ran deficits. McGuinty and the Liberals ran deficits. Meanwhile at the federal level Chretien ran surpluses, Harper ran deficits. At the end of the day the one that hurt people the most was Harris, because while he ran the smaller of the deficits, it came on the backs of reduced services, increased fees, increased municipal taxes because part of the "savings" of the provincial government was just downloading costs to them, and the sale of public assets (which look good briefly on the balance sheet, but didn't actually save people money, since they're still paying the road tolls, still paying for services, etc.) kicking capital projects down the line if not cancelling them altogether.

So it comes down to what's the difference between a deficit while giving people money, and a deficit without giving people money? It's a vote of 'what deficit lets me come out better.' For some it's a 2% reduction to the GST is more important than a balanced budget, for others it's $2K of financial relief a month because we aren't working is more important than a balanced budget.

Poor fiscal policy across all parties proves his point: Canadian voters are retarded across all parties.

But we knew that.

[dimi]

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Take Ontario for example. They've seen it all, they aren't going to buy that any party or ideology is better at balancing budgets than the other. Rae and the NDP ran deficits. Harris and the PCs ran deficits. McGuinty and the Liberals ran deficits. Meanwhile at the federal level Chretien ran surpluses, Harper ran deficits. At the end of the day the one that hurt people the most was Harris, because while he ran the smaller of the deficits, it came on the backs of reduced services, increased fees, increased municipal taxes because part of the "savings" of the provincial government was just downloading costs to them, and the sale of public assets (which look good briefly on the balance sheet, but didn't actually save people money, since they're still paying the road tolls, still paying for services, etc.) kicking capital projects down the line if not cancelling them altogether.

Define and quantify "deficits" and "he ran smaller deficits". McGuinty ran deficits of almost the same amount (not accounting for inflation) as Harris' whole term, IN ONE YEAR.



When people are used to massive overspending and a lack of any sort of budgetary constraint, trying to implement some level of restraint is obviously going to have some negative short term consequences.

At the end of the day, I think the only thing that's going to be bring the financial/monetary situation in this county back to some semblance of reality is a recession. The financial complacency in every level of our society is staggering.