Novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV/COVID-19)

[jutes]

Did any provincial health systems increase ICU capacity during the summer before the first wave? Wasn’t that the whole point, give our systems time to prepare for a second wave, that we are in now, and nothing has changed. More lockdowns are coming because we didn’t do a good enough job obliterating our economies and livelihoods last summer. Protect our hospitals. At any cost.

I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery. - Thomas J.

[revelations]

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I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery. - Thomas J.

You and I do - but the majority dont and wont - until much later. You can see this in how people pin their hopes of a resolution on something like a vaccine, for it only to a) be issued far in the future and b) not actually prevent the spread.

[sabad66]

What is this nonsense about vaccine not preventing spread?

[Buster]

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What is this nonsense about vaccine not preventing spread?

Spread is a bad word to use.

We don't know if the vaccine prevents infection (and therefor the potential for transmission). We only know it prevents disease. It's a common misconception that those are the same thing, they are not. If you are vaccinated, it is quite possible that you can be infected by the virus, have it replicate in your nasal mucosa, and then shed virus particles - all without you getting sick or knowing this is happening.

It's possible that it prevents infection entirely (ie a sterilizing vaccine), but these are actually pretty rare. It's also possible that the vaccine keeps viral loads low so that it is much less likely that you transmit the vaccines even though you technically got infected. However, we don't have data on either of these things. The data is coming, the studies on this are underway, but they were not included in the original trials because we needed the most efficient endpoints we could get to approve the vaccines for disease prevention. In short: we can't assume that me getting the vaccine prevents you without the vaccine from getting it from me.

[sabad66]

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Spread is a bad word to use.

We don't know if the vaccine prevents infection (and therefor the potential for transmission). We only know it prevents disease. It's a common misconception that those are the same thing, they are not. If you are vaccinated, it is quite possible that you can be infected by the virus, have it replicate in your nasal mucosa, and then shed virus particles - all without you getting sick or knowing this is happening.

It's possible that it prevents infection entirely (ie a sterilizing vaccine), but these are actually pretty rare. It's also possible that the vaccine keeps viral loads low so that it is much less likely that you transmit the vaccines even though you technically got infected. However, we don't have data on either of these things. The data is coming, the studies on this are underway, but they were not included in the original trials because we needed the most efficient endpoints we could get to approve the vaccines for disease prevention. In short: we can't assume that me getting the vaccine prevents you without the vaccine from getting it from me.

Good explanation. Sounds like we can’t conclude one way or another yet so it’s not entirely accurate to say “it doesn’t prevent spread”, more like “we don’t know yet if it will prevent spread or not”

[JRSC00LUDE]

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Good explanation. Sounds like we can’t conclude one way or another yet so it’s not entirely accurate to say “it doesn’t prevent spread”, more like “we don’t know yet if it will prevent spread or not”

That's not doom and gloomy enough though.

[revelations]

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What is this nonsense about vaccine not preventing spread?

So its nonsense because Global News, CBC or CNN have not talked about this specific issue?

Its definitely not touted to stop the spread - any discoveries to this effect are forth coming. Any media outlet claiming this should be immediately banned by twitter and facebook - just like they ban other misinformation.

https://www.washington.edu/news/2020...till-critical/

[sabad66]

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So its nonsense because Global News, CBC or CNN have not talked about this specific issue?

Its definitely not touted to stop the spread - any discoveries to this effect are forth coming. Any media outlet claiming this should be immediately banned by twitter and facebook - just like they ban other misinformation.

https://www.washington.edu/news/2020...till-critical/

I’ve seen it talked about, for example here:
https://globalnews.ca/news/7523595/c...nity-covid-19/

They are clear that they don’t know whether or not it stops or slows down spread. The nonsense part is you claiming that it doesn’t when it’s just simply unknown at the moment.

[revelations]

nonsense means that people are clamoring to the hope that somehow the vaccine will ensure a sense of normality - sorry but thats never going to happen. They also have NEVER claimed that it WILL stop the spread. Its not even part of the patent.

Read the UoW report about the new posisble lack of herd immunity thanks to these 'vaccines'.

If I had to get a vaccine for this, it would be the russian Sputnik v over anything from the americans.

[sabad66]

Ending the pandemic doesn’t mean stopping the spread completely/eradicating it. Why do you think that’s the goal?

But yes there is a legit hope that things will be back to normal after enough people are vaccinated.

[Buster]

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Good explanation. Sounds like we can’t conclude one way or another yet so it’s not entirely accurate to say “it doesn’t prevent spread”, more like “we don’t know yet if it will prevent spread or not”

That's correct.

It's the same with claiming that the "UK variant" is more contagious than other variants of covid. We simply do not have the data to make that claim - but the media generally misses the boat on being good at science. Their claim is that the mutation confers some sort of benefit on the virus binding to cell receptors. We have done no studies on the new mutation and how well it binds to receptors, so making that claim is premature. The mistake the media are making in that case is the assumption that one hypothesis is absolutely true, while ignoring all of the other hypotheses. It just shows their limitations on understanding how science works.

[revelations]

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Ending the pandemic doesn’t mean stopping the spread completely/eradicating it. Why do you think that’s the goal?

But yes there is a legit hope that things will be back to normal after enough people are vaccinated.

'ending' the pandemic means the raw case numbers that the politicians and the media focuses on, falls to nil

The only thing the American vaccines are definitely promoting are the reduction in symptoms, which, as is argued by the UoW study, can actually cause more issues than benefits.

Whether or not any reduction in transmission is obtained, is purely a side effect. In other words, this is not going anywhere.

[AndyL]

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That's correct.

It's the same with claiming that the "UK variant" is more contagious than other variants of covid. We simply do not have the data to make that claim

https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imp...eprint-VOC.pdf

Let me guess - it's not done it's full peer review yet; so we should dismiss it.

[Buster]

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https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imp...eprint-VOC.pdf

Let me guess - it's not done it's full peer review yet; so we should dismiss it.

You didn't read the paper, did you?

Or did you read it and not understand it?

[revelations]

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https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imp...eprint-VOC.pdf

Let me guess - it's not done it's full peer review yet; so we should dismiss it.

good to put up some random paragraphs for some context ....

Phylodynamic modelling additionally indicates that genetic diversity of this lineage has changed
in a manner consistent with exponential growth.

Second, we find that changes in VOC frequency inferred from genetic data correspond closely to changes inferred by S-gene target
failures (SGTF) in community-based diagnostic PCR testing.

Third, we examine growth trends in SGTF and non-SGTF case numbers at local area level across England, and show that the VOC
has higher transmissibility than non-VOC lineages, even if the VOC has a different latent period
or generation time.

[AndyL]

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You didn't read the paper, did you?

Or did you read it and not understand it?

Lets let an epidemiologist do the translating for you shall we? ClickyClicky for full thread.

[nzwasp]

Do you think that strain will become a dominant force in Canada too?

[jutes]

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Lets let an epidemiologist do the translating for you shall we? ClickyClicky for full thread.

Interested to see what “much worse” means. Can you lockdown a lockdown? Will we see quadruple layered masks and mandatory PPE in public settings. What’s the next step in this tomfuckery of government sanctions.

[sabad66]

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'ending' the pandemic means the raw case numbers that the politicians and the media focuses on, falls to nil

The only thing the American vaccines are definitely promoting are the reduction in symptoms, which, as is argued by the UoW study, can actually cause more issues than benefits.

Whether or not any reduction in transmission is obtained, is purely a side effect. In other words, this is not going anywhere.

You could be right but I hope you aren’t. Personally I’m predicting pretty close to normal by end of summer and back to complete normal (ie no gathering restrictions or mandatory masks anywhere) this time next year at the latest.

[revelations]

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You could be right but I hope you aren’t. Personally I’m predicting pretty close to normal by end of summer and back to complete normal (ie no gathering restrictions or mandatory masks anywhere) this time next year at the latest.

I dont want to be right, but after 10 months of fuckery, its clear which way this is heading. Its a method of control and subversion. Yes there is a virus, no, its not the black fucking death the MSM is intentionally making it out to be.

I would suggest adjusting expectations and planning ahead - rather than hoping a vaccine is the cure-all it wont be.